F1 European Grand Prix: Valencia 2008

Apparently Valencia will be called the Mediterranean Grand Prix next year, because Nurburgring cannot be called the German Grand Prix. I think it sounds better, tbh.

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You know you want to. [judgegrudge.mybrute.com]

it should be called the 'Spanish GP' in 2010 hopefully

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X (@ed24f1)

I hope not, barcelona is 100 times better than that crappy track.

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Not sure I agree there. Barcelona never provides a GP more interesting than the one we seen at Valencia.

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Well, it has, but only when it's been wet. And I'm fairly sure Valencia will be more exciting than most circuits when it's wet.

Actually, Barcelona has produced an entire 2 1/2 decent races in 18 races. 1991, when it was damp (with Mansell and Senna's legendary battle down the straight, and later Senna's spin out of the final corner) and in 1996, with Schumacher's domination win and stylish last few laps. That's as fun as it's been. 1997 was half interesting as Panis threatened to close on Villeneuve, but that was more my immature and imaginative mind at work than an expected reality... and even if he had, this was Barcelona. He'd still not have passed by 2020.

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Sapo Wrote:
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> Kimi seems really happy too :S And the guy right
> on the teamphoto (with the jeans) is making
> signals to someone to hit felipe with a curveball
> it seems


I think that is Marc Gene, good to see him around!

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2013 - Nando must come through..

gav Wrote:
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> Well, it has, but only when it's been wet. And I'm
> fairly sure Valencia will be more exciting than
> most circuits when it's wet.
>
> Actually, Barcelona has produced an entire 2 1/2
> decent races in 18 races. 1991, when it was damp
> (with Mansell and Senna's legendary battle down
> the straight, and later Senna's spin out of the
> final corner) and in 1996, with Schumacher's
> domination win and stylish last few laps. That's
> as fun as it's been. 1997 was half interesting as
> Panis threatened to close on Villeneuve, but that
> was more my immature and imaginative mind at work
> than an expected reality... and even if he had,
> this was Barcelona. He'd still not have passed by
> 2020.

To me, the weather provided that race, not Barcelona. Barcelona just happened to be in the way of the weather tbh.

It really puts it into perspective through. Every time we get a new circuit we hear all these F1 fans crying about terrible new circuits and how they have no soul, are all the same, etc. But yet they all provide better racing than Barcelona, Hungary and Mangy Cours.

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Bruninho schreef:
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> I hope not, barcelona is 100 times better than
> that crappy track.


Maybe it's more fun to drive on (which I think you're aiming at), but only 22 out of 6 billion people get to drive there. The other 5,999,999,978 people want a track that provides a race that's fun to watch. And I think Valencia has a bigger chance to do that than Barcelona.

HOW! HOW!!!! HOWWWW!!!!!

Come on, just admit that the Valencia GP was a bore-fest, I slept for the entire GP after the start, the track is dull, boring (for both points of view, driver and spectator) crappy, full of long straights and annoying hard braking points, big run offs forgiving everyones mistakes and no scenery (not that i am bothered with the scenery, i am not a tourist but when the track is crap and the race is boring we look at the scenery to find something good and... omfg its total crap!) You cannot call it a street track yet alone a Monaco look alike track.

I dont see why we should have a gp in a crappy city, I dont like any of the new modern tracks, they are all boring and I have never seen a good race in them. Its laughable to see them going to race at new places (singapore, bahrain, shanghai, sepang, and the upcoming abu dhabi track, to name a few) where the citizens dont know what the f*** is F1 or who the f*** is Lewis Hamilton!

Only Istanbul looks good for me and thats just because of Turn 8, otherwise it would be just another crappy modern track.

Barcelona is 1000 times better, just dont provide overtaking because a) they @#$%& up the final corners, the corner after Campsa and b) the cars full of aero bs. With the 2009 cars a lot of overtaking down the main straight will be possible, so f*** Valencia!

Even a revamped Rio Circuit would be 1000 times better and more exciting than these modern crappy tilke tracks. That's Formula Boring for me when they race at these new tracks. Cant wait for Spa...

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Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 08/30/2008 05:02PM by Bruninho.

lol at the agressiveness!

anyways, i think Valencia is fun to drive, it was a boring GP, but F-1 is never been a sport with a lot of overtaking maneuvers, peple who got into F1 to see overtaking are wrong, or if your favourite driver is in F1 and expect to see him overtake 5 cars in one race like he used to did in the previous series, then sorry but you guys are wrong as well...

Valencia is a STREET TACK!, and even if it was a boring GP it is fun to drive, being a street track, it has a lot of fast corners and great straights with a bridge to cross, yatchs to watch, and the last sector looks amazing from the outside so it would be even more fun to drive it.. but what would you know?, you slept the entire gp, and it was the first time F1 race there, so you need to wait for next year to make a good judgement..

i loved t the track, and if Barcelona will provide more overtaking next year with the new regulations, then so will Valencia, or the Mediterranean gp, or whatever name they choose for this track

Come on, just admit that the Valencia GP was a bore-fest, I slept for the entire GP after the start, the track is dull, boring (for both points of view, driver and spectator)

Nobody said the European GP was any good. We all agreed it was dull. However, several drivers disagreed from your "point of view of the driver" statement, so no, I disagree there. The circuit looked quite exciting, despite the lack of action, and Lewis even called the track "Fantastic". So I don't see where you got the drivers point of view from.

big run offs forgiving everyones mistakes and no scenery (not that i am bothered with the scenery, i am not a tourist but when the track is crap and the race is boring we look at the scenery to find something good and... omfg its total crap!)

This can be applied to Barcelona too. Big run offs, no scenery (a field is not scenery), and terrible racing.

You cannot call it a street track yet alone a Monaco look alike track.

As was previously discussed, the circuit utilises streets. Whilst a lot of it doesn't at the moment, it will become permanent streets within the next few years as the area develops. It is not a Monaco look alike, and I highly doubt anyone with common sense has said that. But it is a street circuit.

Barcelona is 1000 times better, just dont provide overtaking because a) they @#$%& up the final corners, the corner after Campsa and b) the cars full of aero bs. With the 2009 cars a lot of overtaking down the main straight will be possible, so f*** Valencia!

Barcelona was built in 1991, which means it is far from a classic. Some of us may even call it...modern. Barcelona has hosted GPs since its first year in 1991. Back then, you may or may not know, that aerodynamics were not as big a problem as they are now days. They were able to follow very closely and overtake much easier than todays cars can. Despite this, Barcelona has never produced a good race without the weather being involved. Only 2 races can be called "good" and that was 1996, when the weather was horrific, and as Gav pointed out, 1991, when the weather was damp. It has hosted 18 Grand Prixs and has never produced a good GP. The weather produced 2, the circuit has produced none. And this is despite running through an era of Formula 1 where aerodynamics were not an issue. Currently there is no reason to suggest that when the wings are clipped for 2009, things will improve at Barcelona. Infact, evidence suggests otherwise.

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Bruninho Wrote:
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> where the citizens dont know what the f***
> is F1

That statement reminds me of someone here on his board, can't quite put my finger on who it is though.... :P

Bruninho does have a point, though. He is going back to what F1 is all about - the quickest cars on the planet doing what they do best. It is great to watch an F1 car do a lap at a special track such as Spa, Monaco, and Monza. But watch a car do a lap at any Tilke track and you'll probably be bored out of your pants. Each track has its bad years and good years, each track has it's years when there's good racing. So if you can get a track that is a very nice lap, and sometimes provides good racing too, then why not?

It's a shame that it's difficult to make a track that does both at the same time. The Tilke tracks are taking it too far and focussing far too much on overtaking only.

It's the reason that we all love Spa - the lap is fantastic. Our favourite tracks are so because of the great corners in them. In the end, I think this is what makes F1 so special - the reason that we watch F1 over any other motorsport. They do unbelievable laps on fantastic tracks.

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You know you want to. [judgegrudge.mybrute.com]

Bruninho does have a point, though. He is going back to what F1 is all about - the quickest cars on the planet doing what they do best. It is great to watch an F1 car do a lap at a special track such as Spa, Monaco, and Monza. But watch a car do a lap at any Tilke track and you'll probably be bored out of your pants. Each track has its bad years and good years, each track has it's years when there's good racing. So if you can get a track that is a very nice lap, and sometimes provides good racing too, then why not?

Well actually, you've said Bruninho has a pointed and then backed everyone else up.

So if you can get a track that is a very nice lap, and sometimes provides good racing too, then why not?

Exactly. Valencia has had 1 race. Why write it off now? Spa produced plenty of bad races and wasn't dropped suddenly, was it?

And as pointed out, Barcelona has never provided a good race, so cannot come under the category "sometimes provides good racing too". Which also answers your final question - "why not?".

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Personally I prefer Valencia over Barcelona, but in that post I'm saying that I can see where Bruninho is coming from, that's all. I generalised a bit as it went on but you see what I mean.

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You know you want to. [judgegrudge.mybrute.com]

i think that the huge runoff areas on modern tracks make the cars look slower than they actally are. put the barriers on the edge of the track at e.g. bahrain and it will look awesome althoug the layout remains. that´s why monace has this special feeling even when there are no overtakings. you know that every single second something can happen...

It is completely unfair to compare Valencia to Monaco.

Monaco is a race that oozes character and atmosphere but then it the best part of 80 years old and has been held every year (bar one or two during the war period).

I very much doubt that the 1929 Monaco Grand Prix was considered a classic venue that oozed character and atmosphere and that is exactly why Valencia wasn't this year, because it was it's first event.

As has already been covered the Valencia street circuit is pretty much a purpose built Grand Prix facility, it's fairly unusual for the track to be there first and the streets later, but I think this was a moment of genius. They had pretty much a blank sheet of paper to work from, space to develop a layout and then the street track factor will come as the area develops around the circuit. A designer street track, very clever.

The layout isn't bad and does have potential, I'm sure there will be more overtaking in future races when it should be possible to follow other cars a bit closer.

And as has already been covered I don't think Barcelona has ever produced a bit of racing[[/b] that wasn't caused by either the weather or some other outside factor like the tyre war or mechanical failure creating a rare overtaking opportunity.

Barcelona isn't even that great a track to drive anymore either, because they have pretty much destroyed any corner of substance.

flat tyre Wrote:
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> Bruninho does have a point, though. He is going
> back to what F1 is all about - the quickest cars
> on the planet doing what they do best. It is great
> to watch an F1 car do a lap at a special track
> such as Spa, Monaco, and Monza. But watch a car do
> a lap at any Tilke track and you'll probably be
> bored out of your pants.

To be honest, I think the final sector at Valencia is one the best sectors of any current F1 track. The only ones in my opinion which could be considered as good or better are sectors 1 at Silverstone or Spa.

The 2nd last corner at Valencia is one of those classics to me. Hugely demanding and technical at the same time.

Give the place a few years to get battered about at bit, especially when road traffic starts using it, and Valencia will become much more appealing.

I don't recall a lot of run off space from the Valencia broadcast. There looked to be a lot of walls close by from. Given the number of tracks with healthy runoffs, maybe that put a little caution into the minds of the drivers before attempting an overtake, except Coulthard perhaps.