Codemasters' F1 game discussion

The race AI isn't fake (apparently!) just qual and practice.

The general AI standard is utterly broken but this just adds another level of frustration.

Although having said that I leave it on and damage too because that's where the real challenge of this game lies - trying to win with the AI cheating and several random punctures along the way :P

The race AI isn't fake (apparently!) just qual and practice.

Of course it is. The lap times they set vary by 10 seconds depending on where the player car is at the time. So why bother simulating fuel usage on the AI when the lap times are meaningless?

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theRacingLine.net
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I have to say I've not noticed the race AI being fake since deleting the catchup file (obviously you can't do that on your Xbox or on the PS3). Race pace seems spot on - certainly those around you - which it clearly isn't in practice & qual.

DaveEllis Wrote:
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> The race AI isn't fake (apparently!) just qual and
> practice.
>
> Of course it is. The lap times they set vary by 10
> seconds depending on where the player car is at
> the time. So why bother simulating fuel usage on
> the AI when the lap times are meaningless?


I've never seen the laptimes vary that much. The most I've seen is 4-5 seconds and that's caused by the rubber banding.

They're horribly inconsistent but not fake imo...

gav Wrote:
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> I have to say I've not noticed the race AI being
> fake since deleting the catchup file (obviously
> you can't do that on your Xbox or on the PS3).
> Race pace seems spot on - certainly those around
> you - which it clearly isn't in practice & qual.


I noticed after deleting catchup.xml that the AI seemed faster at the beginning of a race. On the second lap Alonso set a time a second quicker than his Qualifying time!

So presumably whatever AI fuel effect Codies programmed in was entirely relative to the pace of the player car

It's possibly discussed already, but I don't want to go through all the pages

Anyhow i'm playing on PC. And even though I'm not the best setup maker, i got my fair bit of knowledge for it.
But the AI is just blasting past me on some tracks regarding speed/acceleration. I can't possibly lower the wings anymore in order to maintain a proper speed throughout the corners. But when I block them on one side and force them to lower speed, they still can get enough speed to pass me around the other side unless I push them in the grass/run-off areas. (and yes, I know the wings aren't the only thing that are involved into the speed of the car)
Therefor I can't attack the AI for position at the end of straights and I'm always looking at 3-4 tenths of a second when coming out of a slow corner (hairpin). Just can't accelerate quicker without spinning my car.

AI: Legend
TC: Off
Tyre sim: On
Fuel sim: On
Damage: Full
Penalties: Full
Gears: Auto

Car: I drove BMW, and Force India - not the worst cars with engine performance I would say

Anyone got something on this, maybe experienced yourself?

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If you are racing, keep on racing and get some points!

GPG Super League S11 | Driver #41 | Team-manager | Snake Motorsports Racing Group | Next Race: Emmeloord - Flevoland GP | Constructors: 10th | Best Race Finish: 1st
GPG Super League Season 9 Testers Champion*

I think the aforementioned rubber-banding works solely by increasing the bhp of the AI cars... you could try deleting catchup.xml but tbh I think it runs deeper than that!

I've never seen the laptimes vary that much.

Best example is when a fast car gets stuck at the back for whatever reason. I had Vettel pit early for no apparent reason and get stuck behind di Grassi (slowest car in the game), and make NO progress at all. When di Grassi pitted, Vettel continued on at low speed.

It REALLY pisses me off that Steven Hood, Chief Game Designer said that there would NOT be AI Catch-up in the game. When it came out, I said there was and he said it must be a bug and asked me for details. But there is a f**king catchup.xml. Did he think people wouldn't notice this sort of stuff? Or is he so terrible at his job that he didn't even know about it?

Either way, he clearly is completely useless.

But the AI is just blasting past me on some tracks regarding speed/acceleration. I can't possibly lower the wings anymore in order to maintain a proper speed throughout the corners.

The AI cars performance is dictated by straight line speed only. The Red Bull AI is the same speed in the corner as the Virgin AI. That is why you get blown away on the straights, because the AI speed is exaggerated to get the performance gaps.

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theRacingLine.net
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MDBSnake, I don't know if auto gears is penalised (I always drive manual), but try putting the engine into "fast" mode... I've no idea if the engine mileage is simulated (save for them mentioning it in the loading screens).

In my brief attempts at offline races (pc pre patch) I did notice on legend that at some tracks the AI would have absurd acceleration at around 100mph in some places - i.e. their exit and top speeds were fine, but in mid-range acceleration they would sometimes seem to just blast off for a few seconds.
An example I can remember was at Suzuka between Degner 2 and the hairpin - I seem to remember noticing the AI accelerating really quickly through that little straight before the hairpin, though their cornering speeds seemed fine.
Anyone want to try it out and see if they notice the same?

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I'm the opposite at Suzuka. I've done a few races there (including a 100% race) and I was closing out of Degner 2 and if there was a car ahead I was making a place every lap down the inside into the hairpin (Kamui-style). I did think they were a bit good out of the hairpin though.

gav Wrote:
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> I'm the opposite at Suzuka. I've done a few races
> there (including a 100% race) and I was closing
> out of Degner 2 and if there was a car ahead I was
> making a place every lap down the inside into the
> hairpin (Kamui-style). I did think they were a bit
> good out of the hairpin though.

Ah it's probably after the hairpin I was thinking of - come to think of it I seem to remember them braking far too early into that hairpin - but I've definitely noticed it happening at a few different tracks and places.

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Batracer - the online racing manager game - join here [batracer.com]

I get the feeling pace is simulated per position. E.g. say around Bahrain first place is around 1m57.0 and 1m58.5, 2nd is around 1m57.3 and 1m58.8, last place is around 2m02.0 and 2m03.5, etc. regardless of catchup.xml, as I still notice this after deleting catchup.xml.

That's why if Vettel for example pits early and gets stuck in 18th position, he can't go any faster so then he stays in the position as the position dictates his pace rather than his car or his skill.

Another thing I noticed that also points to this is for example when I'm 9th behind say Kubica after the start, for the first 8 laps before anybody pits, he stays consistently about 1.5 to 2 seconds ahead of me. As soon as the Red Bulls, Ferraris and Mclarens pit, before him, and end up behind us, he starts strolling away because he is in 3rd now suddenly. And this is not an illusion, I am in my 6th season now on 40% races and this happens a lot.

That's what I liked about GP4's AI, they were always true to form and related to the specific car. If this game had GP4's AI it would have been the perfect game.

Ho3n3r Wrote:
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> That's what I liked about GP4's AI, they were
> always true to form and related to the specific
> car. If this game had GP4's AI it would have been
> the perfect game.

Thats what i wish in every car game/Simulation.

What bugs me about the Codemasters AI is they got so much right. They don't crawl around turn 1 for example. Fine they aren't super fast, and you can make up spots, but the GP4 AI camps out at turn 1 for a sing song before continuing on its way. The Codemasters AI also isn't afraid to use other lines, and don't fall over as soon as you put them on the outside.

Those are the difficult things to do with the AI. The really basic stuff such as allowing them to actually drive somewhat realistically is the easy stuff!

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That's true, as well as things like the subtlety of the wing angle changes mid-lap, where you can feel the difference just enough but not enough to totally transform the car, and the engine throttle mapping.

The contract offers are a shambles at the moment as you can win 3 seasons and the only teams that offer you contracts - excluding your rival's - are Sauber, Force India and Toro Rosso(the bottom 3 always offers me so that's pointless).

So after whipping the Mclaren boys 3 years in a row they still deem their drivers as better than me? Hahahaha. That'll never happen in real life. The reputaion meter climb is also way too shallow the higher you get. I have only climbed from low 32 to mid 33 after winning 15 of my last 29 races! Where in the lower teams your rep climbs almost a 3rd of the rep meter by just finishing a race, be it 5th or 24th.

If they can tweak that a little it'll be awesome.

It's a good base to work from though. Next year it will all be about tweaking the AI system to make it more realistic, and improving the menu system, and HUD. At least they don't have to work too hard on the graphics as it's awesome already.

They should have put Crammond in the team to develop the game further...

i have, luckely, not noticed any rubber banding ai on the xbox, but the ai lap times on lap 1 is worthless, i can pull away with 2-3 seconds on the first lap yet the ai´s lap times are 4-5 sec faster than me..kinda sucks.
What annoys me alot is that sometimes certain cars(mostly the Virgins) get transparent so they drive throu you or u can drive throu them...i mean, wtf is that??

Graphics are awesome, the different engine sounds in every car is great!...
they should have released this game later in the year and sorted out all the idiotic mistakes, i wish i could get my money back as this game is hardly finished or playable. And i agree with Ho3n3r on the contracts situation, i finisehd 3rd in the HRT in my first season, yet, Sauber were the best option presented to me...

It seems the PC patch is out as well, when I started up the game an hour ago I got that there was an update and unless I would install it I would not be signed in (online) at GFWL.
So far it seems to be working, there is some sort of a GAP system now to the car in front/behind, based on total racing time. Also a pitstop in a 20% race, I was released by the team while a Toro Rosso was parking his car at his team (right in front of me), I needed to slow down for it to avoid collision (automatic since there is no actual Manual pitlane control) but I was released and didn't lost positions.

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If you are racing, keep on racing and get some points!

GPG Super League S11 | Driver #41 | Team-manager | Snake Motorsports Racing Group | Next Race: Emmeloord - Flevoland GP | Constructors: 10th | Best Race Finish: 1st
GPG Super League Season 9 Testers Champion*

True! .... You can download it here also: [www.codemasters.fr]

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Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/02/2010 04:14PM by Excalibur.

is it out for the xbox????