What would you pay for a champ car sim?

LFS has the best system for arms in any game i have played.

The lcd display on the speed 7 wheel is optional. I found a concept drawing on some site.

Meh good arms in t-cam, no arms in cockpit, lovely functional steering wheel = happy Lloydy....

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now imagine well done hands and arms in cockpit view.... super realistic

the descent steering wheel & arms in cockpit was only part of my suggestion..this could an be option select on/off , etc....
maybe the developers could ask the question....what would you like to see in your racing sims to make it more realistic & playable....it seems some are making the games more attractive to look at which is great but at the expense of playability.....

a realistic looking cockpit in a near as realistic handling car which will give you the sensation that you are actually driving the car......as above arms/steering wheel etc......the helmet visor in gp4 cockpit view was a good start but needed to be moveable in relation to helmet movement to car....

someday some forward thinking developer is going to think like this...probadly a former modder...racing sims are re-hashing old ideas atm....bring on the next generation sims now............he who succeeds sells.....

the helmet visor in gp4 cockpit view was a good start but needed to be moveable in relation to helmet movement to car....

Stuff like that is eye candy and isnt needed.

[teamidt.net]

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Agreed Dave...

When i started playing racing games i looked only at graphics, fiddled with setups to be honest...

Now, due to my racing in an rFactor league, i have been forced to learn how to set the car up and i appreciate more the realism. I'm not saying rFactor is spot on, the fastest thing i've driven is a formula ford, so i wouldn't know, but i definitely prefer realism over eye candy...you want realism, wear race overalls and a helmet to drive, and hook up one of those cyclers feeds :p

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GLD Wrote:
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> Agreed Dave...
>
> When i started playing racing games i looked only
> at graphics, fiddled with setups to be honest...
>
> Now, due to my racing in an rFactor league, i have
> been forced to learn how to set the car up and i
> appreciate more the realism. I'm not saying
> rFactor is spot on, the fastest thing i've driven
> is a formula ford, so i wouldn't know, but i
> definitely prefer realism over eye candy...you
> want realism, wear race overalls and a helmet to
> drive, and hook up one of those cyclers feeds :p
>
>

and buy a real f1 cockpit!

Guimengo Wrote:
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> now imagine well done hands and arms in cockpit
> view.... super realistic

No... you see... it's not realistic... unless you watch a motor-racing octopus championship, with multiple arms...

Having the wheel isn't realistic either, but it provides necessary feedback in my opinion...

Realistic is having your own cockpit, driving using your own wheel, turned with your own arms. I don't need to see some other dudes fake arms.

I see the argument for having arms and wheels and things for keyboard players, but saying as keyboard support in games is merely a bolt-on extra, and takes away the whole 'simmness' of it, then it's a bit irrelevent in my opinion. It's a sim. Use a wheel. It's not GT4.

we will never change our opinions on this, so I guess it's useless to keep going. Just hope the game is pretty good.

It's not an opinion. It's a fact. Whether it's better or not is a fair discussion, but having extra arms (and a wheel for that matter) isn't realistic.

that's your opinion and I disagree. Why have a helmet or driver at all then? Would love to see replays with the cars driving by themselves

everyone seems to have an opinion on the steering wheels & arms issue...the simplist solution is for the games developers to remember many different types of people play these sims & try to accomadate them if possible....the best way maybe could be a simple option to switch these items on/off....etc.....

& dave for you to dismiss the visor as just eye candy & not give it a second thought is a bit worrying..i hope people in the industry don't have these brush any ideas that i don't like to one side also.....the visor was used as an example....

maybe put up a post asking people what they would like to see in their sims to make them more realistic/playable/enjoyable.......

Guimengo Wrote:
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> that's your opinion and I disagree. Why have a
> helmet or driver at all then? Would love to see
> replays with the cars driving by themselves

Off board, fine yeah - arms and wheels and things would be better suited, but it's hardly an important aspect of a game, what the thing looks like in a replay

Live, in car, I think arms just get in the way. If you play with a wheel. If you don't, then it's not a sim. Simple as.

& dave for you to dismiss the visor as just eye candy & not give it a second thought is a bit worrying..i hope people in the industry don't have these brush any ideas that i don't like to one side also.....the visor was used as an example....

It IS eye candy. It doesnt add anything to the game. You dont see the visor in real life when you have a helmet on. You see past the visor. Real vision is much less restricted than in a game. Is there any need to restrict the view further?

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hmm... to asnwer the question...

around $30-$40

- - - - -
Roberto - CTDP

www.rob38designs.co.nr

DaveEllis Wrote:
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> It IS eye candy. It doesnt add anything to the
> game. You dont see the visor in real life when you
> have a helmet on. You see past the visor. Real
> vision is much less restricted than in a game. Is
> there any need to restrict the view further?
>

An excellent point, I hate the visors in GP4...

zeppelin101 Wrote:
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> DaveEllis Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > It IS eye candy. It doesnt add anything to
> the
> > game. You dont see the visor in real life
> when you
> > have a helmet on. You see past the visor.
> Real
> > vision is much less restricted than in a
> game. Is
> > there any need to restrict the view further?
> >
>
> An excellent point, I hate the visors in GP4...
>
>
>
> my point....not everyone likes/dislikes the same things..have an option to switch certain things on/off....about the eye candy..people like their games to look visually nice also.....many will quickly jump on the wagon & say the game looks like crap...no point asking how much someone wants to pay for a game ,when they are not sure what they are getting......ask them what they want to be put in /developed in future games.....some games developers need to sometimes take their blinkers off for a while.......
you keep dismissing things you don't like off hand & pretty soon one day you'll be developing games no one wants to buy........

>
>

jimbob1 Wrote:
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> my point....not everyone likes/dislikes the
> same things..have an option to switch certain
> things on/off....

Fair point (and I'd love it to be the same way), but if there's an feature which is a bit, lets say touch and go, it will inevitably be left out. The same will apply to most games, let alone in this genre.

Wearing a helmet everyday, I can quite confidently say you never notice a visor. Perhaps helmet dependant, but with the 2 makes I've had, you wouldn't be able to see a visor, as you're essentially looking down out of it, never straight.

I agree with your final point though. Dave and the crew might not be aware of it, but they'll likely be developing a game as they want it, while that view might not be what the majority want... knowing Dave well, and the community he's a part of, that's likely not the case, but they will need to take a step back once in a while and re-assess from the neutrals perspective. That's the stance I've tried to adopt. Not being a fan of the rF engine, perhaps I can see a certain angle the iDT crew might not, so if I see a fault, or something which I feel could be done better from an external point of view, I'll gladly point it out. I'll most likely be GPGs worst critic of this CC game, but as with everything else, I do it as a neutral and constructively, and not taking sides, which would be rather easy in this sort of instance.

Oh im not a fan of the ISI gMotor2 engine either. I've been very critical of it on the private forums on where it needs updated. Main points being FFB (front wheels especially) and driving feel.

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well im not gonna sit here and blow sunshine up your arse... i think we need to know more about this game to decide what we would pay. I mean if its gonna be good people will pay more, but tbh i think people really dont wanna pay more than £29.99 for a good pro game.