Magny Cours Grand Prix ***SPOILERS***

What the hell. I dodge these topics now, have had it with all the Hamilton bashing, he tried a pass, its racing, the stewards ruled it was unfair and he got unfairly penalised. I also saw Raikkonen getting away with ruining Sutils race in Monaco, and also saw Hamilton drive brilliantly to win at Monaco after a mistake. Some of you need to get your heads checked and remember what F1 should be, overtaking and fair officials.

I just look back at last year for example, this is just an example ok.

Alonso at the start of Canada and Spain he did not get a bashing for that. JB hit nick in Monaco and alonso hit nick no one slatted them for that.

I agree lewis has made errors and got penalties for them but just like the FIA its not been consistant

Today Lewis tried to pass he got it wrong end of, he did not hit a car (already said that I know) and got a penalty yet people have hit cars Lewis as well and not got a penalty. Had kimi got the penalty that he should have done for canada from monaco lewis would not have hit him in the pits people say sutil should not have been there in monaco for kimi to hit well kimi should not have been in that position in canada I hope you can see what I mean and not jump down my throat. In Monaco kimi should have got a drive through yes it would have been harsh but he should have got one or a 10 place drop at the next race. Lewis today made an error just like kimi did in Monaco 1 gets punished the other does not, yet one damaged 2 cars the one today did not.

People are also glossing over the fact that there was a dangerous car on the track today that could have cause a nasty accident, anyone remember Alesi in Monza that year when the camera fell off the car and hit the other ferrari. I was waiting for that to happen today. Kimi should have been pulled into the pits I find it hard to believe that he did not. Also at the pit stop ferrari made to attempt to remove the broken part.

He also done some good over taking like the move on alonso yet no one has said good move. He also over took other cars as well but all that is mentioned is the error.

Anyway thats all from me now you will be glad to hear



Edited 4 time(s). Last edit at 06/23/2008 03:08AM by marcl.

Shinnbob Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> What the hell. I dodge these topics now, have had
> it with all the Hamilton bashing, he tried a pass,
> its racing, the stewards ruled it was unfair and
> he got unfairly penalised. I also saw Raikkonen
> getting away with ruining Sutils race in Monaco,
> and also saw Hamilton drive brilliantly to win at
> Monaco after a mistake. Some of you need to get
> your heads checked and remember what F1 should be,
> overtaking and fair officials.


If the stewards ruled it was unfair, then sounds like he got fairly penalised. There's a difference between losing control and ending up in the back of someone, and making a dangerous pass under your own will.

The reason why people appear to be focused on Hamiltons errors is simply that he is in one of the best cars, constantly talking up his chances (or having others do it for him)and yet is making silly mistakes at almost every GP.

Everybody slammed Massa after his first two poor races, but since then he has performed constantly well. No-one offers anything but praise for Kubica, because he has driven absolutely mistake free for the whole season so far and isn't in a car that can challenge Ferrari or McLaren at most times.

As others have said, Lewis simply needs to stop talking to the press and concentrate on driving - that's what he's paid to do.

And just to give my opinion on the now old issue of Kimi vs Sutil at Monaco, remember that Sutil shouldn't have been there in the first place - he passed cars under the yellow flags and should have been penalised or disqualified.

Obviously the stewards didn't bother penalising Sutil becasue he was eliminated in the race (punishment enough) and there is really no point in giving a driver a 5/10 place grid penalty when they usually qualify 19th anyway

I'm assuming the reason why Kimi wasn't penalised was simply because if Sutil had followed the rules, he would not have been in front of Kimi when he lost control - so most likely Kimi would've only taken himself out.

Regardless, the incidents in Monaco, Canada, and now France are now all over - on to the next race!

bender Wrote:
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> Regardless, the incidents in Monaco, Canada, and
> now France are now all over - on to the next race!

I've already said this many times, but our friends here like to dwell in the past

Not a great race, but good result from a Championship perspective. As an Alonso fan I was disappointed to have such a dreadful run, and as a neutral I'd like to see Hamilton do well at Silverstone to bring the World Championship cotnenders a bit closer together.

---

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Please find us on [en.wikipedia.org] for more information.

btw, im not sure if its been said, but why was Kimi allowed to carry on with abit of car hanging of the back??

there was a very high chance it could flung off and hit someone either driving or a marshal and probably seriously injured them? I dont understand why ferrari didnt try attempt to yank it off at the pitstop. I have expected a black flag.

---

"Trulli was slowing down like he wanted to have a picnic" LOL

I already said that before Chet

chet schreef:
-------------------------------------------------------
> btw, im not sure if its been said, but why was
> Kimi allowed to carry on with abit of car hanging
> of the back??
>
> there was a very high chance it could flung off
> and hit someone either driving or a marshal and
> probably seriously injured them? I dont understand
> why ferrari didnt try attempt to yank it off at
> the pitstop. I have expected a black flag.


its an exhaust, you cant just yank it off id think, its bloody hot. Though these risks are there for racing, theres not for nothing on your ticket: on your own risk, a wheel could fly off and hit someone to, its just racing, it didnt happen, so its good isnt it.

There are rules regarding loose parts on cars though and people in the past have been pulled in to have them removed. Yes I agree a wheel could fly off etc but this was a bit different to a freak accident as people have said that could have hit another car a driver or someone else. It should have been removed.

It was probably cold by the time kimi pitted remember is was only being held to the car by a wire it was no longer part of the engine.

As people keep saying here rules are rules



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/23/2008 10:57AM by marcl.

They could have wrapped a tyre warmer on it then yanked it off or something... they have plenty of heat sheilding equipment.

Usually when something is hanging off your car, drivers normally have the initiative to pit and get it sorted. For all we know it could have been very sharp, what if it came off a driver right behind who didnt have time to move went over got a puncture lost control and crashed?

The car should have been black flagged. Im not saying its Kimis fault, he probably asked if he should pit and Ferrari probably told him to stay out, but it was a wrong decision to keep him out with that peice hanging off the car.

Yes I suppose these things happen at races, but you go to a race expecting to see a race (debatable at Magny... ) you dont go and expect to be hit by a tyre or peice of car lol. If so why not give everyone helmets ???

---

"Trulli was slowing down like he wanted to have a picnic" LOL

As I said before it could have been like Monza in 1995 when the Camera from Alesi ferrari took out the other ferrari.

All they had to do was cut that wire and it would have come off, that would have added an extra 2 seconds to the final pit stop.

Anyway its done now, yes he should have been bought it but he was not and no one got hurt this time.

Btw had that come off and hit the driver behind in the visor it probably would have killed him. As I said it was luck today nothing like that happened. Had it happened people would then be saying ferrari and the FIA done the wrong thing by leaving him out.

I think Jackie Stewart sums it up really.

[www.autosport.com]



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 06/23/2008 11:33AM by marcl.

Shinnbob Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> What the hell. I dodge these topics now, have had
> it with all the Hamilton bashing, he tried a pass,
> its racing, the stewards ruled it was unfair and
> he got unfairly penalised. I also saw Raikkonen
> getting away with ruining Sutils race in Monaco,
> and also saw Hamilton drive brilliantly to win at
> Monaco after a mistake. Some of you need to get
> your heads checked and remember what F1 should be,
> overtaking and fair officials.

He was praised so much last year, and rightly so, but when things swing the other way, all of a sudden it's "Hamilton bashing"? These last few races he's been awful. He's having a very poor year.

Melboure: started the season off well and strongly

Sepang: had no pace (though at the time we just thought it was an off day) and well beaten by his team-mate

Sakhir: had no pace and crashed into another car (wrecking his own race and harming the other driver's)

Barcelona: he was OK. Nothing special, and could have been beaten by his under-achieving team-mate

Istanbul: very poor qualifying, decent race, but again his team-mate was the stronger driver
Monaco: rookie mistake and only won as the weather and strategy lucked his way

Montreal: looked quick, but another rookie mistake

Magny-cours: 2 mistakes on his 2 qualifying laps, punted his own team-mate, got a penalty for another incident, and still had no pace

Had last season been filled with rookie mistakes, then fair enough, but it wasn't - it was special. This season he's trying to do a Senna by making up the difference in a slower car and he just doesn't have the ability or mental strength to do so. Had he not made these cockups (and carry on how he did last year) he'd likely be leading the championship by a good 5-10 points, but instead he's 10 points back in a slower car with very little chance of finishing higher than 3rd unless Ferrari cock things up.

There is many things badly wrong with FIA.. Its easy to see they are backing Kimi and it looks really badly like they would be trying to make McLarens races more difficult. Sure some penalties have been for reason, but definately not nesesary in thiskind amounts.

And with this Mosley s**t people fears to open their mouth. Williams have said (unofficially = not recorded) that nobody wants to take risk that FIA ignores their team registerations for next season. Only reason why we dont have more teams atm is that leader of MAFIA wanted to show who rules in F1 and desided not to sing the Concorde Agreement.

Atm FIA is literally MAFIA.. F1 is just their playground. This s**t cannot be called sports and any champion titles shouldnt be given.

Kimi, so, Massa Fernando Sebastian is faster than you. Can you confirm you understood that message?

I agree with some of what you have said Gav but have to say a few things.

"Sepang: had no pace (though at the time we just thought it was an off day) and well beaten by his team-mate"

He would have been 3rd had his pit stop not gone wrong.

"Sakhir: had no pace and crashed into another car (wrecking his own race and harming the other driver's)"

We dont know his true pace as he messed up the start then as you said damaged his car and alonso's.

"Barcelona: he was OK. Nothing special, and could have been beaten by his under-achieving team-mate"

He was quite a way ahead of Kovy before his pit stop if I remember correct, please tell me if I am wrong. Kovy went longer in the race but would not have been on Lewis tail. But we dont know as Kovy crashed.

Turkey though I thought he had a great race seeing that he had to do 3 stops. Yes his quali lap was poor and Kovy would probably have won the race had he not had the puncture. But Lewis drove flat out that whole race and was there at the end dispite having to make an extra stop. Had that been a few other drivers people would have said good job.

And yes I agree about the points thing I said that before, but Kimi and massa have also thrown away points this year any of them could have been leading by 10 points. The driver that is not making the errors is Kubica so far the star of the year and by a long way.

For me Lewis is carrying on like he ended last year with errors. Remember China and Brazil 2 errors that cost him the championship well he is doing the same errors this year.

As I said I hope neither ferrari or mclaren win the championship this year.

It just reminds me of JB 2nd year in F1, all the praise in the 1st year then a poor 2nd year. Its happens to so many drivers.

Lewis needs to get his head back in order, not speak just drive and find the form he had last year. I dont even think its a car setup problem it just him trying to do the impossible sometimes as he thinks he can do what the car can not do.

We all see it differently and thats great it would be boring if we all thought the same



Edited 4 time(s). Last edit at 06/23/2008 12:22PM by marcl.

Locke Cole Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> As an Alonso fan I was
> disappointed to have such a dreadful run, and as a
> neutral I'd like to see Hamilton do well at
> Silverstone to bring the World Championship
> cotnenders a bit closer together.


Alonso was nowhere, really. Change the strategy from three to two stops was killing his race. His two stints with 28 fuel laps where very difficult. Three stints of 19 would have been much better.

And Hamilton, again too aggressive. A light touch with his team-mate (who eventually left him pass at the beginning of the race) and yes, not very fast after all. Heidfeld....uff. This could be the final race to take a decision. One thing is not to find the set-ups and finish 6th or 7th when you can finish 4th or 5th, but ending in 13th...



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 06/23/2008 02:09PM by Ali.

Funny how some of you can go on and on on something just relax and dont focus on it anymore.

Nick has a contract for next year its Kubica who does not.

If what we are told is true then Alonso is now free to leave renault at the end of the year as they did not get the target points.

I think Kubica will stay at BMW as for alonso god knows, I dont think Honda or bmw I recon he will stay at renault.

gav Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I think more are starting to see the Lewis
> Hamilton I saw last year now. I said from
> mid-season or so that I thought he was a
> manipulative, moaning, arrogant sod with the team
> and press wrapped around his extended middle
> finger. He's let his success and talent get to his
> head this year, and in every race this season it's
> coming out more and more. In truth he's just not
> dealing with the pressure. I said that in the last
> 3 races he's made 3 potentially race ruining
> mistakes, but it's 4 if you include him running
> into Heikki today. Last year he let his driving do
> the talking. This year he doesn't have that to
> fall back on, and his mouth is doing it all. It's
> just making him look more of a prick.

Yes. Even James Allen acknowledges the changing opinion of the British press. [www.itv-f1.com] (2nd question, Seth Allen. No relation I'm sure! )

The foreign press, James says, have had this issue with Lewis and his "sense of ‘entitlement’" to walk into the top team straightaway.

James also says, "Many members of the public in Britain resent it too". Yes. I'm not getting fed up with Lewis, I am. His language used when speaking after the race yesterday, kept saying "you" to the reporters. Why?! Did they penalise you?

I honestly think Lewis thought he was brilliant in 2007 and so 2008 would be even easier. He fought off Alonso who left McLaren. What could be a better start to an F1 career than to get rid of a double world champion team mate?

Course now Lewis has to lead the team and he hasn't got a double world champion team mate to motivate himself with. At the end of the 2007 season Lewis said that he lost the title by only 2 points so it won't be that hard to get the 2 points back next season. What?! So because you lost by two points one season you'll get those two points back next time around and win? Grow up.

I do not really remember people like Senna, Prost, MS, kimi, mika etc saying they are great etc they just showed what they could do on the track. Senna for example always said he would never be the best as the best was Fangio. All a driver can do is be the best or I would say most succesful of their time.

It seems to be a british thing lol mansell, dc, JB and now lewis all bigged them selves up. Mansell well things were never his fault, DC next year will be my year, JB I will beat them into the 1st turn etc and lewis. I just think lewis wants to be loved by everyone he thinks he is the best and no one can tell him different. Could it be his way of dealing with loosing? I dont know.

I thought Canada would knock him down a peg but no.

Lewis has gone about things the wrong way and he needs to turn this round and do it fast. He needs to get fans and the press back onside.

I still like the guy and think he is one of the most talented guys out there he just needs to stop the errors.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/23/2008 04:11PM by marcl.