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Voted!

msater Wrote:
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> Both of our
> drivers are happy at Phoenix AFAIK.

It's right for me mate.

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My GPGSL Career

We are mostly talking about drivers here now, making them more equal but I think it might be better to equal all the teams. Give all the teams the same starters bhp at the start of s5 - we might result in getting the same teams on top, but it might also not happen that way. I do believe however GP4 is stronger based on teams then on drivers, so when you've got a strong team you are more likely to win then with a very skilled driver at a lower team

@Marko, you've won 7 times and lost 47, but there are people who have 'lost' all the time then

What I do see, since I'm driving with midfield/back-marker teams is that at the start of the season I can get fairly good results and then it's just getting lower each time. Maybe we should reverse the system of how performance points are giving. Let's say the guy whom wins gets the lowest amount of points - the guy who finish last (including failures of any kind) will get the most perf points.

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If you are racing, keep on racing and get some points!

GPG Super League S11 | Driver #41 | Team-manager | Snake Motorsports Racing Group | Next Race: Emmeloord - Flevoland GP | Constructors: 10th | Best Race Finish: 1st
GPG Super League Season 9 Testers Champion*

MDBSnake schrieb:
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> We are mostly talking about drivers here now,
> making them more equal but I think it might be
> better to equal all the teams. Give all the teams
> the same starters bhp at the start of s5 - we
> might result in getting the same teams on top, but
> it might also not happen that way. I do believe
> however GP4 is stronger based on teams then on
> drivers, so when you've got a strong team you are
> more likely to win then with a very skilled driver
> at a lower team
>


I agree with you, that GP4 is a lot more team-perf based than driver-perf based. Otherwise it wouldn't be possible for me to get such good results whilst other new testdrivers end at the end of the startup.
But - in my opinion- your proposal is only the second step. First one is to improve the driver-market and give some other people the chance to race from time to time as well. Because if this isn't an aim of the series, you don't need to do all the effort with testdrivers- and sessions.
One idea I would like to bring to discussion would be, that drivers get older and only are able to RACE (test driver time excluded!!!) for 5 seasons. After that they have to retire and can join the series again with a fresh new driver, if they like.
I'm very aware of the fact, that many people won't like this idea. But again, if this series just wants to stay in a private area with only the "old" persons acting in it, it isn't necessary at all to introduce new persons into the series.


>
> What I do see, since I'm driving with
> midfield/back-marker teams is that at the start of
> the season I can get fairly good results and then
> it's just getting lower each time. Maybe we should
> reverse the system of how performance points are
> giving. Let's say the guy whom wins gets the
> lowest amount of points - the guy who finish last
> (including failures of any kind) will get the most
> perf points.

That would be one idea when you stay at the old system. In combination with my recommendation it would be contra-productive, I think. But I begin to like the idea, that the perf-file raises get shortened a bit, so that the consequences don't raise that much during the season.


GPGSL : Team Owner of 'Maverick Track Performance' (MTP)

Clearly there is an issue with domination, Phoenix are the only team to have won a race out of the Big 3 this season and IED the 4th best team are 70 points away from 3rd placed TSS right now

But is a performance reset the only way to fix this problem, it undoes all the effort made by the top 3 teams to get there,

One thing to point out is that from Season 1, of the top 3 teams that year, none of them are still top teams

Even in the case of Phoenix, we chased them for 4th in Season 2, beating them by just a point or something like that, but the next season they finished last while we ended up second

There is still quite a lot of diversity in the field, especially in the midfield, look how close it is

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Races: 163 - Wins: 23 - Pole Positions: 24 - Fastest Laps: 22
Season 9: Constructors' Champions

Ferrari2007 Wrote:
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> Clearly there is an issue with domination, Phoenix
> are the only team to have won a race out of the
> Big 3 this season and IED the 4th best team are 70
> points away from 3rd placed TSS right now
>
> But is a performance reset the only way to fix
> this problem, it undoes all the effort made by the
> top 3 teams to get there,
>
> One thing to point out is that from Season 1, of
> the top 3 teams that year, none of them are still
> top teams
>
> Even in the case of Phoenix, we chased them for
> 4th in Season 2, beating them by just a point or
> something like that, but the next season they
> finished last while we ended up second
>
> There is still quite a lot of diversity in the
> field, especially in the midfield, look how close
> it is

In S2; Double F went down the standings too.

nhorry Schreef:
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> msater Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > If team owners couldn't drive or had to drive
> for
> > their own team it would certainly shake things
> up
> > a bit.
>
> +1
>
> .... and voted!



+1

That would be fair.

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My Grand Prix 4 Files
I'm a total dick. How many people can say that?

Ferrari2007 Wrote:
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> Clearly there is an issue with domination, Phoenix
> are the only team to have won a race out of the
> Big 3 this season and IED the 4th best team are 70
> points away from 3rd placed TSS right now
>
> But is a performance reset the only way to fix
> this problem, it undoes all the effort made by the
> top 3 teams to get there,
>
> One thing to point out is that from Season 1, of
> the top 3 teams that year, none of them are still
> top teams
>
> Even in the case of Phoenix, we chased them for
> 4th in Season 2, beating them by just a point or
> something like that, but the next season they
> finished last while we ended up second
>
> There is still quite a lot of diversity in the
> field, especially in the midfield, look how close
> it is

this is my point of view about phoenix's disappointing S3:
in last season,when i made my debut as tester in round 2,"boost sender" role wasn't assigned at 100%.In first times was Mal who sent boosts,then in the late season I decide to take the role(infact the car improved,and Zak Tonks finished 3rd at Interlagos).In fact,I believe that team boosts are very important,and you need to be a bit clever when you use it.

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My GPGSL Career

msater Wrote:
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> If team owners couldn't drive or had to drive for
> their own team it would certainly shake things up
> a bit. TSS would need to new drivers as both of
> our current drivers (me and Ed) are both team
> owners (Phoenix and Alpha). I suppose TSS would
> use the testers, would again would shake things up
> a bit. Also, if I had to drive for Phoenix, my
> team, what would one driver do? Both of our
> drivers are happy at Phoenix AFAIK.
>
> Interesting questions though.

well you could either swap with your Phoenix drivers, or even consider forfeiting one of your roles if you wanted to - as i would consider doing if this rule passed.

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X (@ed24f1)

Slight problem with the tester perf, will update later tonight.



5 x WCC - S5, S6, S7, S8, S10 | 4 x WDC - S5 Nick van der Voort ; S6, S7, S8 Ed Greenhalgh | 2 x WTC - S6 Stuart Ingers; S8 Andrei Sevastian

How about a capped level of performance? Like you reach a level of being the best a person can be as a driver and you dont get beyond that. That way people have a catch up. Maybe like if your in the top ten percent then your perf would improve at half the rate it would for someone in the lower ten percent?


My extreme idea is a team budget:P So you pay for engine and drivers but you would have to sacrifice having two top drivers if you want a top engine as well?

icky Wrote:
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> How about a capped level of performance? Like you
> reach a level of being the best a person can be as
> a driver and you dont get beyond that. That way
> people have a catch up. Maybe like if your in the
> top ten percent then your perf would improve at
> half the rate it would for someone in the lower
> ten percent?
>
>
> My extreme idea is a team budget:P So you pay for
> engine and drivers but you would have to sacrifice
> having two top drivers if you want a top engine as
> well?

To me, the first idea seems interesting. The second idea sounds more like something that would be done in Grand Prix World - whether people would be receptive to that kind of idea is questionable.



My idea would be of a ballast system, albeit with a reduction in perf instead of a weight increase over a single race weekend.

However, it doesn't really solve the problem of the stagnant driver market - and it would be hellishly confusing for the series organisers.

How about a test driver draft system

At the half way point of the season and then again at the end the team who is currently in last in the standings has the chance to replace one of there race drivers with the driver who is top of the test championship

It'd get testers into the series but then again it could annoy drivers who are being replaced

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Races: 163 - Wins: 23 - Pole Positions: 24 - Fastest Laps: 22
Season 9: Constructors' Champions

icky Wrote:
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> My extreme idea is a team budget:P So you pay for
> engine and drivers but you would have to sacrifice
> having two top drivers if you want a top engine as
> well?

Nice idea. Would be hard to implement but if we could get it goping that would be a great way to solve this problem and shake the series up a bit!

Also agree with Dan, well said mate.

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but if the 2 best drivers of the championship are in the same team, one of them could be replaced, which is fairly unrealistic to me :p

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Gaulty Schreef:
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> Voted... some of those ideas if implemented are
> certainly something I would not be interested in
> at all.

Agree, some are absolute bullshit, for example the rule to force a team to put a tester into a race seat, that's just not fair for the race driver..

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I personally wouldn't be interested in a series that included having a budget, or something like that

I've been involved in one before at GP4World and it fell flat after a few rounds, I think the basic series rules we have here are very good and effective

@Tim It'd only be the team that is slowest in the Constructors championship

For example say VSM are last at the end of the year, they get the first draft pick of the testers, this means they would be able to take the pick of the best tester in the series, before another team can

This draft rule coupled with your own idea of driver changes only be able to happen at set points in the year, I believe would help give a flow to the drivers and testers series

Possibly adding the rule for Team Owners not being able to drive could help too, as Ed said earlier he would have to consider either driving for TSS or owning Alpha, say Ed did choose to drive for TSS, this would mean his team would be passed onto the first person on the waiting list, who I believe is Mal, Monil & Phil would also have to make this choice and would create even more fluidity in both the driver market and team ownership

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Races: 163 - Wins: 23 - Pole Positions: 24 - Fastest Laps: 22
Season 9: Constructors' Champions

racingstefan schrieb:
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> Gaulty Schreef:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Voted... some of those ideas if implemented are
> > certainly something I would not be interested
> in
> > at all.
>
> Agree, some are absolute bullshit, for example the
> rule to force a team to put a tester into a race
> seat, that's just not fair for the race driver..

Don't you think it's a bit insulting to call it bullshit? At least the administration has done some efforts to create POSSIBLE RECOMMENDATIONS, not less and not more.
I don't favor this idea either - although it would finally bring some action into the driver-market - but that's no excuse for becoming offensive in a certain way.

And regarding your point that it wouldn't be fair for the race driver: Is it on the other hand fair, that a test driver (like Zak Tonks for example), who's performance points are higher than these of some race drivers, doesn't get a chance on a race seat because these just become disposed between all the existing race drivers. And then you (not especially you Stefan, but all here) wonder, why he becomes inactive


GPGSL : Team Owner of 'Maverick Track Performance' (MTP)

Tester perf now updated.



5 x WCC - S5, S6, S7, S8, S10 | 4 x WDC - S5 Nick van der Voort ; S6, S7, S8 Ed Greenhalgh | 2 x WTC - S6 Stuart Ingers; S8 Andrei Sevastian

Answered the polls. I must say I'm pretty happy wit the way the GPGSL works atm. I think we could do with a slight tweak to the team boosts and the people that matter know about that but otherwise I feel it's going well! We have a good mix whereby both team owners and drivers have a decisive role to play in the series. There's no point in making the teams more equal as that would leave team owners with nothing to do. At the moment the reason owners become drivers is because being a team owner is a bit too easy. Overall though I'd suggest an approach of 'if it ain't broke, don't fix it!'

Quote
Ferrari2007
How about a test driver draft system

At the half way point of the season and then again at the end the team who is currently in last in the standings has the chance to replace one of there race drivers with the driver who is top of the test championship

It'd get testers into the series but then again it could annoy drivers who are being replaced

There is nothing stopping any team owners replacing race drivers with the top test drivers now, all you have to do is ask.



5 x WCC - S5, S6, S7, S8, S10 | 4 x WDC - S5 Nick van der Voort ; S6, S7, S8 Ed Greenhalgh | 2 x WTC - S6 Stuart Ingers; S8 Andrei Sevastian