Malaysian F1 Grand Prix ***SPOILERS***

marcl Wrote:
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> I fully expect both mclarens to be dropped 5
> places on the grid.

I'm not so sure a penalty should be handed out. This is a fairly new trend (only happened a few times in the recent qualifying and only if they did their time 1-lap early) and it would be harsh to penalise all of them.

They should be dragged up and shouted at a lot (and their team for not informing them there were still laps being started behind them) and be told that any repeat will warrant such a penalty.

It's hard, as no matter what you do, there has to be some points on the circuit where you inevitably end up on the racing line. Turns 5 and 6 it would have been a nightmare to cruise back while staying off the racing line all the time, and perhaps that's where Alonso lost his time.

Still, here's another way of looking at it. I fail to see how Alonso slowing down Massa in Monza '06 is impeding a competitor, yet this isn't.

There shouldn't be any penalties handed out anyway as after setting your last time you have to go into fuel saving mode as the qualy format has been changed. If it was like last year Nick would not have been impeded. Still this was worth getting up for, I missed out of the first 15 mins due me sleeping over a bit. So i would just like to ask what was in those first 15 mins if possible. Thanks

That Piquet bit was a bit OTT, ITV now trying to focus on other drivers now that their contract has been cut,

Monza972 Wrote:
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> There shouldn't be any penalties handed out anyway
> as after setting your last time you have to go
> into fuel saving mode as the qualy format has been
> changed.

That's a very, very strange attempt at justification, and while I'm not necessarily disagreeing with your conclusion, I totally disagree with your means of arriving at it.

Credit to Piquet too. He was still nearly half a second slower than Alonso, but it's a decent improvement over Melbourne. Trulli is obviously doing well, and Glock wasn't bad either.

Alonso has also complained now as well.

They might just say from now on dont do this but they could give both mclarens, kubica and massa a penalty, also webber was on the racing line in turn 3 so what do they do give most of the top 10 a penalty lol.

Kubica, Massa and Kimi were off the racing line. Some others were sitting on the line, that was the real issue.

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marcl schreef:
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> Alonso has also complained now as well.
>
> They might just say from now on dont do this but
> they could give both mclarens, kubica and massa a
> penalty, also webber was on the racing line in
> turn 3 so what do they do give most of the top 10
> a penalty lol.


Kubica, Webber and Massa where NOT on the racing line, only Hamilton and Kovalainen, here a pic:

[img208.imageshack.us]

clearly that only hami and kovi are on the racing line, from what i saw is that when heidfeld passed massa that he was off the line, just as kimi was off the line.

Neither McLaren learnt the lesson either, as they stayed on the line when Alonso arrived too.

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Lewis moved str8 over after nick went passed, webber was on the racing line when nick was going passed not for alonso.

And massa was in the middle of the road when nick was on his lap but did not hold up alonso. Massa was in the middle of the track approaching the tight corner so it would have also put nick off.

but by the time alonso got to the 4 cars he was held up as it was at the corner.

I think they should get 5 slot drop its only fair and that will stop it from happening again. Maybe not massa but the rest.

Anyway both mclaren drivers have been called in so i do expect them to start 5 places down. It will give people want they want anyway a chance to see lewis try and get back up the field.



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 03/22/2008 10:19AM by marcl.

Iceman-Kimi Wrote:
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> clearly that only hami and kovi are on the racing
> line, from what i saw is that when heidfeld passed
> massa that he was off the line, just as kimi was
> off the line.

Agree...I was quite surprised while watching the session. There were a lot of cars there in both sides of the track while two drivers were in a hot lap!!! it is very dangerous as NIck is waving from side to side of the track to avoid them...was really dangerous... but I don't think nobody is going to be penalized. Anyway, Alonso was penalized by much less than that in 06.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/22/2008 10:22AM by Ali.

The mclaren drivers say they were not told anyone else was on a hot lap so thats why they were not moving over!

If you remember that rule that was put in place years back after the burger alesi incident in monza that you are not allowed to pass after the session is over. Kubica was going very very slow and the mclaren drivers were going passed him so the whole thing is a mess up. They should have left the rule in that you had to complete your in lap within a certain time.

So yes I think they will get the 5 place drop its only right I will be shocked if they dont.

As Ali Alonso got that penalty and should not have.

Both Mclaren drivers clearly had a chance to stay out of the racing line while doing their slow down lap.

I think this team just got so full of themselves that they think their the only ones who has a potential to pull off a last second surprise. They showed total disregard for their opponents.

They should be penalized. Penalties have been given before to lighter offenses.

Here's a video summary of Nick's final lap...

[rapidshare.com]

Which is why they will get a penalty simple as that, mistakes happen and they will probably start 7 and 8 but maybe even 9 and 10 or worse.

If the team fails to tell the driver that no one is still on a fast lap they think the session is over and this is what happened I am not saying they are right so dont think that. I dont think the drivers done it on purpose either they just thought everyone was done so they did not move off the line. As soon as nick went passed lewis got off the line but kovy did not but as I said the 2 mclarens held up nick but lewis kovy and kubica all held up alonso.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/22/2008 11:03AM by marcl.

clearly it's also teams mistake not drivers only...but yeah they should get penalty.

Lol just imagine if Lewis gets penalty of 5 positions he will start alongiside(or just behind) Alonso

sweet

Alonso was also disturbed...
[img220.imageshack.us]

'So yes I think they will get the 5 place drop its only right I will be shocked if they dont.'

It's not right. What is 'right' is that the rule gets changed, and there are two ways of going about that...

1. A mininum speed.

2. Allowing any amount of fuel so that we get cars running on fumes like the good old days.

Penalising the drivers would not be the right thing to do there. The teams, maybe, but I still would oppose that approach. Just forget about it and change the rule.

@marcl

I agree with you.

I also don't think the drivers did it on purpose. I understand that at that stage of qualifying, things can be very uncertain for the drivers.

I think this is more of the team's lack of monitoring the opponent's progress. After their cars were done and they know the Ferrari's were done ahead of them, they simply dismissed all the others and went on focusing only on conserving their fuel.

The grid will probably be.

Massa
kimi
trulli
Nick
Alonso
Webber
Alonso
Glock
Kovy
Lewis
Kubica

But lewis and and kovy could get a 10 place penalty as they held up 2 drivers.

Quali 3 just sucks now tbh they need to do light fuel runs and give a bit of paper in at the start with the fuel load they want to start with simple as that.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 03/22/2008 11:14AM by marcl.

Much though I like Kovi and Hamilton, the evidence is pretty incriminating. I don't think it would be unreasonable to drop them down the grid, especially since the Alonso picture seems to show a McLaren too, unless I've misinterpreted it. The team might not have told them that there were cars on flying laps behind them, but they have mirrors, and at 30mph, they can afford to look in them.

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Turns out lewis did not hold up alonso that was kovy. As I said lewis pulled over after nick went passed.

It as hard to see what was going on.

I think lewis is going to claim he had no where to go both kovy and kubica were going se slow that he was boxed in.

Kubica did not hold anyone up both lewis and kubica let alonso pass

There are some other stories that infact lewis was going for a 2nd run and got held up himself I dont know if that is true but on the radio the team told him to do 2 runs at the start of his 1st lap? anyone know if thats true?