Honda might be running on unstable ground....
Posted by Joe_Satriani
selling one team would be hard enough, trying to sell at the moment would be ridiculous
i think red bull should be ok, their sales shouldn't have gone down too much...
however, i think williams are most at risk
X (@ed24f1)
i think red bull should be ok, their sales shouldn't have gone down too much...
however, i think williams are most at risk
X (@ed24f1)
i wonder if Brawn will work again somewhere
it would be great to have him back at ferrari, but i doubt he will go to a top team again. maybe williams could do with someone like him if they want to restructure their personnel
X (@ed24f1)
it would be great to have him back at ferrari, but i doubt he will go to a top team again. maybe williams could do with someone like him if they want to restructure their personnel
X (@ed24f1)
SchueyFan Wrote:
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> i think red bull should be ok, their sales
> shouldn't have gone down too much...
Its a good point. Remember peoples luxury expenditure is going down, but a car costs thousands, a can of Red Bull costs what, £1? Demand for cars will always be lower in depressions etc, but until everyone is poverty stricken they will still buy products like these.
In the end we could just see Mclaren, Ferrari, Red Bull, TR and Williams as the five teams
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> i think red bull should be ok, their sales
> shouldn't have gone down too much...
Its a good point. Remember peoples luxury expenditure is going down, but a car costs thousands, a can of Red Bull costs what, £1? Demand for cars will always be lower in depressions etc, but until everyone is poverty stricken they will still buy products like these.
In the end we could just see Mclaren, Ferrari, Red Bull, TR and Williams as the five teams
Does kinda make you think back to the days when of the loss of the privateers, and big manufacturers coming in.
Frank Williams said in an interview a few days ago that the current financial situation would affect the car makers more as Williams were strictly in the business of making racing cars, and not churning out road cars.
Be interesting to see what happens if anymore manufacturers pull out. Hopefully it wont be a grid consisting of U.E.A owned cars :P
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Frank Williams said in an interview a few days ago that the current financial situation would affect the car makers more as Williams were strictly in the business of making racing cars, and not churning out road cars.
Be interesting to see what happens if anymore manufacturers pull out. Hopefully it wont be a grid consisting of U.E.A owned cars :P
LS's Tip of the week
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Red Bull reported record spending on their F1 Department, versus their income from sponsorship which only actually came to £10 million. Everything else was out of their own pockets.
Maybe Red Bull knew of Hondas shortfall, and perhaps because of that, they bought Bergers share of the team, in the hope that of those interested in the purchase of Honda, if there were a few interests, maybe Toro Rosso could be passed on the the loser of the Honda deal whilst the interest was around... who knows.
As for Williams, they have no pressure but to simply go racing, and pay everyones wages and enough sponsorship to see them through the season and development into next seasons car. There is a lot less pressure on them than the billions manufacturers are disposing of everywhere.
Williams is efficient at what it does, and for a while their privateer status has been their setback. However, new rules, and capped limits, I think Williams are about to shine again. Just look at Toyota!
Jenson drives it like he owns it; Lewis drives it like he stole it
Maybe Red Bull knew of Hondas shortfall, and perhaps because of that, they bought Bergers share of the team, in the hope that of those interested in the purchase of Honda, if there were a few interests, maybe Toro Rosso could be passed on the the loser of the Honda deal whilst the interest was around... who knows.
As for Williams, they have no pressure but to simply go racing, and pay everyones wages and enough sponsorship to see them through the season and development into next seasons car. There is a lot less pressure on them than the billions manufacturers are disposing of everywhere.
Williams is efficient at what it does, and for a while their privateer status has been their setback. However, new rules, and capped limits, I think Williams are about to shine again. Just look at Toyota!
Like has been said though TF get money from Panasonic.
Honda's earthdreams was a good idea, sadly at the wrong time.
There were of course rumours of being able to get a large sponsor, hense earth dreams but only rumours, afterall we do know about Honda's adverstising it's not at all far fetched it was a decision from Japan not to go with sponsors despite being offered? We wont know. We do know that earthdreams did contribute to the fact that as a team HondaF1 will not be on the grid at Australia.
I hope within the next few weeks a buyer is found and a large sponsor can be couped. If that's possible there's every chance of a year based on Honda's foundations. Similar to Hondas 2006 season I guess. A very good year with a win all based on BAR's foundations.
"Trulli was slowing down like he wanted to have a picnic" LOL
Honda's earthdreams was a good idea, sadly at the wrong time.
There were of course rumours of being able to get a large sponsor, hense earth dreams but only rumours, afterall we do know about Honda's adverstising it's not at all far fetched it was a decision from Japan not to go with sponsors despite being offered? We wont know. We do know that earthdreams did contribute to the fact that as a team HondaF1 will not be on the grid at Australia.
I hope within the next few weeks a buyer is found and a large sponsor can be couped. If that's possible there's every chance of a year based on Honda's foundations. Similar to Hondas 2006 season I guess. A very good year with a win all based on BAR's foundations.
"Trulli was slowing down like he wanted to have a picnic" LOL
Panasonic is a special case as far as sponsorships go. Matsushita Electric and Toyota partnership (Panasonic EV Energy 40% Panasonic, 60% Toyota IIRC) goes back to 1996 long before the decision to enter Formula 1. Panasonic and Toyota capital ties are not that strong (< 1% stakes) but even now Toyota's stake in Panasonic which was bought in 2007 is worth at least 250 million.
As for BAR/Honda, they've always struggled with sponsorship. It's always been basically a Lucky Strike fag packet on wheels, the further from 1999 the less non BAT sponsors on the car. A team that for years was pretty much sponsored by it's owners won't IMO turn down a major sponsorship so the earthdream [sic] in hindsight was probably an attempt to attract sponsorship.
As for BAR/Honda, they've always struggled with sponsorship. It's always been basically a Lucky Strike fag packet on wheels, the further from 1999 the less non BAT sponsors on the car. A team that for years was pretty much sponsored by it's owners won't IMO turn down a major sponsorship so the earthdream [sic] in hindsight was probably an attempt to attract sponsorship.
tripleM Wrote:
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> A team that
> for years was pretty much sponsored by it's owners
> won't IMO turn down a major sponsorship so the
> earthdream in hindsight was probably an attempt
> to attract sponsorship.
Agreed. No team will turn down sponsorship when they have had sponsors, they obviously didn't get that big offer from a sponsor otherwise they deffinately would have been using them
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> A team that
> for years was pretty much sponsored by it's owners
> won't IMO turn down a major sponsorship so the
> earthdream in hindsight was probably an attempt
> to attract sponsorship.
Agreed. No team will turn down sponsorship when they have had sponsors, they obviously didn't get that big offer from a sponsor otherwise they deffinately would have been using them
no, but the important point is - honda didn't have to leave F1, they chose to.
that is a very important difference
X (@ed24f1)
that is a very important difference
X (@ed24f1)
Ferrari president Luca di Montezemolo has revealed that the Formula One Teams’ Association wants to arrange a meeting with Bernie Ecclestone to discuss changes to the way the sport’s revenues are distributed.
FOTA met in London on Thursday to discuss cost-cutting measures following a request from FIA president Max Mosley to come up with drastic proposals, a meeting which the teams say resulted in agreements over "substantial cost cutting for 2009 and 2010".
But in addition to planning a meeting with Mosley to present their plans, FOTA chairman di Montezemolo says the group has also decided it needs to meet with the sport’s commercial rights supremo to talk about how more money from the F1 pot can go the way of the teams.
"In the short run we'll organise a meeting with Max Mosley to present him the details of our proposals and to discuss with him how to improve the show our sport offers,” di Montezemolo said.
“Furthermore we also agreed that it's necessary to meet with Bernie Ecclestone to talk about the distribution as far as the earnings are concerned."
Mosley indicated in July that he was keen to see the teams get more of F1’s revenues, but argued that it should be the private teams that benefit to ensure the grid is not dominated by the car companies.
“I do think the teams should have more of the revenue, but more important is that it should be distributed differently,” he told journalists in Monaco at the time.
“The teams need to look after the independent teams.
“I would give more money to the independent teams and not give any to the manufacturer teams on the grounds that they are the one who push the budgets up.”
This week’s bombshell announcement that Japanese car giant Honda was pulling out of Formula 1 due to financial concerns has emphasised the need for the sport’s stakeholders to agree cost-cutting measures.
"First of all I want to say that I was very satisfied with the meeting's extremely cooperative climate,” he said.
“We unanimously took some very important decisions with short-term and mid-term impact, for the years 2009 and 2010, while we also set out a proposal for a new engine starting in 2011.
“We gave a further input as far as cost reduction is concerned to help especially the smaller teams over the upcoming season.
“It's a huge effort from all of us, which is important for two reasons: firstly because it wasn't planned, considering what has been planned a few weeks ago, and secondly, because it happens in a very delicate overall economical situation."
The Ferrari president added that he thought the teams had answered Mosley’s request to come up with radical cost reduction measures and that these wouldn’t impact on the sport's core appeal.
"I think that we've given an unanimous reply to the requests FIA has made several times; therefore we've shown that we have a great capacity to react and to suggest solutions, backed by all of us protagonists in Formula 1, from the big car manufacturers to the independent teams," the Italian said.
“The aim is to reach unanimous decisions, which satisfy all our requests, while we don't touch Formula 1 as a sporty and technological competition amongst teams."
LS's Tip of the week
ESSENTIAL OILS aren't essential unless you're an engine, a gearbox or a twat
FOTA met in London on Thursday to discuss cost-cutting measures following a request from FIA president Max Mosley to come up with drastic proposals, a meeting which the teams say resulted in agreements over "substantial cost cutting for 2009 and 2010".
But in addition to planning a meeting with Mosley to present their plans, FOTA chairman di Montezemolo says the group has also decided it needs to meet with the sport’s commercial rights supremo to talk about how more money from the F1 pot can go the way of the teams.
"In the short run we'll organise a meeting with Max Mosley to present him the details of our proposals and to discuss with him how to improve the show our sport offers,” di Montezemolo said.
“Furthermore we also agreed that it's necessary to meet with Bernie Ecclestone to talk about the distribution as far as the earnings are concerned."
Mosley indicated in July that he was keen to see the teams get more of F1’s revenues, but argued that it should be the private teams that benefit to ensure the grid is not dominated by the car companies.
“I do think the teams should have more of the revenue, but more important is that it should be distributed differently,” he told journalists in Monaco at the time.
“The teams need to look after the independent teams.
“I would give more money to the independent teams and not give any to the manufacturer teams on the grounds that they are the one who push the budgets up.”
This week’s bombshell announcement that Japanese car giant Honda was pulling out of Formula 1 due to financial concerns has emphasised the need for the sport’s stakeholders to agree cost-cutting measures.
"First of all I want to say that I was very satisfied with the meeting's extremely cooperative climate,” he said.
“We unanimously took some very important decisions with short-term and mid-term impact, for the years 2009 and 2010, while we also set out a proposal for a new engine starting in 2011.
“We gave a further input as far as cost reduction is concerned to help especially the smaller teams over the upcoming season.
“It's a huge effort from all of us, which is important for two reasons: firstly because it wasn't planned, considering what has been planned a few weeks ago, and secondly, because it happens in a very delicate overall economical situation."
The Ferrari president added that he thought the teams had answered Mosley’s request to come up with radical cost reduction measures and that these wouldn’t impact on the sport's core appeal.
"I think that we've given an unanimous reply to the requests FIA has made several times; therefore we've shown that we have a great capacity to react and to suggest solutions, backed by all of us protagonists in Formula 1, from the big car manufacturers to the independent teams," the Italian said.
“The aim is to reach unanimous decisions, which satisfy all our requests, while we don't touch Formula 1 as a sporty and technological competition amongst teams."
LS's Tip of the week
ESSENTIAL OILS aren't essential unless you're an engine, a gearbox or a twat
someone decided to find out whether the teams pay their bills on time or not, and here are the results!
[en.f1-live.com]
X (@ed24f1)
[en.f1-live.com]
X (@ed24f1)
In that case, FI still spending millions to finish last ?? It works both ways, Honda still maybe spending more but when you think about it isnt it a waste of money for FI also?
It's not as easy as just saying no loss because they spent millions to finish last is it?
From such a powerful man and for someone that has so much influence that is such a poor way to look at it. How do you think those 700 people will feel reading that? Though not directly refereing to the team at Brackley Honda was still that team at Brackley.
"Trulli was slowing down like he wanted to have a picnic" LOL
It's not as easy as just saying no loss because they spent millions to finish last is it?
From such a powerful man and for someone that has so much influence that is such a poor way to look at it. How do you think those 700 people will feel reading that? Though not directly refereing to the team at Brackley Honda was still that team at Brackley.
"Trulli was slowing down like he wanted to have a picnic" LOL
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