The 2014 Formula One Season

gav Wrote:
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> It's a fair point that Hulkenberg has had some
> pretty average teammates. Barrichello was very
> much on the downward spiral, and arguably barely
> good enough for F1.

I wouldn't agree, the season prior to their pairing Barrichello won two Grand Prix, and these came in the second half of the season when Red Bull and McLaren had developed their cars to eliminate the early season performance advantage that the Brawn had. I don't think Rubens would have managed that if he wasn't good enough for F1.

If we're going to conclude that Barrichello was barley good enough for F1 in 2010, then we'd have to also conclude that at least half the grid weren't good enough either.

And Hulkenberg has enough standout performances to suggest him worthy of a drive with a front running team, not least his pole position at Brazil in 2010, numerous races in the second half of 2012, and dragging that Sauber above where it had any right to be in the first half of 2013 and then continuing to punch above it's weight in the second half of the year, the showing at Monza was particulary massive.

In 2009 Barrichello was in what was overall still the best car, and possibly only won because Button seemed to let the pressure get to his driving and his performances started to falter.

Barrichello, while generally beating Maldonado in the races in the first half of his final season, was comprehensively beaten by him in the second half of the season. We know Maldonado can be a good driver on his day, but it's difficult to suggest the FW33 could provide many of them.

It's easy to suggest Hulkenberg's standout performances only highlight his inconsistency, something which is certainly improving (as demonstrated in the latter half of this season), but if it's taking him this long to develop as a regular challenger in F1, then you have to think he'd struggle to challenge a top teammate over a season.

I'm going to stick with my Frentzen comparison for now; very good, and like Frentzen I'd love it if he got a drive in a top team, but I can understand why they aren't willing to jump for him yet.

Lotus would have been a good fit for both of them and in hindsight he'd have been a much better choice than Perez for McLaren last season.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/08/2013 12:28PM by gav.

gav Wrote:
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> In 2009 Barrichello was in what was overall still
> the best car, and possibly only won because Button
> seemed to let the pressure get to his driving and
> his performances started to falter.

I think this is pretty harsh. The Brawn was no longer the best car by the time Rubens won in it, and his wins were quality ones. In Valencia he owned Jenson all weekend and trounced Lewis in a straight fight for the win. It was one of the drives of that season. He was on fire when he won at Monza too(Even Martin Brundle said during that race that Rubens was in the form of his life). Basically it didn't matter what Jenson was doing at those times, Rubens was just plain quicker.

Regarding Rubens' form in 2010, he was good enough for F1 even in late 2011, so I'm not sure how it can be argued he wasn't a year earlier. He did have a steady start to 2010, but after a few races he got into his stride and delivered some cracking drives(You even suggested yourself after Valencia 2010 that he might be the driver of that race). So I think he was plenty good enough to be an accurate barometer of the Hulk's form. He was definitely no Graham Hill 1974-75.

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Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 12/09/2013 05:40AM by EC83.

this is absolutely true to me. barrichello had speed in 2009 and 2010. Lets not forget he would have won nurburgring 2009 w/o any troubles, had it not been (ironically) for massa. this would have made him much more serious championship contender later on in the season as well.

However, the points that apart from rubens, niconever had good teammates. the best one was di resta and they pretty even Stevens.
One might argue that hulk was new comer to those teams, but the fact is that if someone want to look for excuses he can always find them. In reality, rubens destroyed hulk, by scoring twice as many points as him, and eventhough nico was new to the team, rubens was no better than a, let's say '96 Hill. The newcomer then, Jacuques, owned hill big time. he even had to let him through in the first race. no excuses were needed then that jacques is new to team. The situation with hamilton and alonso is the same.

Please, dont get me wrong: I would be really happy to see nico do well! he is a very likeable guy and and crafty racer + very fun to watch. It is just that the media overrate him big time in my view. He may indeed be a S.V. or L.H. or F.A. in making, but he may just as well be a Jean Alesi, H.H Frentzen or the like.

So much hate for Dhill

But I don't think Williams would've ordered Jaques to back off if there wasn't oil spewing from his engine? I remember that well - Damon's car was brown!

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GPGSL -
GPGSL-3 - Pizza Party Racing manager and driver
Nations Cup - Team Scotland manager

"Double points are to be awarded at the final race of the season, a change to the scoring system that will begin in 2014."

Source: BBC Sport

...seems a bit gimmicky, don't you think?

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Whoever made up that rule needs to have his head cut off

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GPGSL -
GPGSL-3 - Pizza Party Racing manager and driver
Nations Cup - Team Scotland manager

Confirmed via autosport: [www.autosport.com]

Intrigued that autosport felt the need to put these paragraphs:
"Had that system been in place in recent years, it would have changed the outcome of both the 2012 and '08 title fights.

Sebastian Vettel and Lewis Hamilton won those crowns respectively by claiming sufficient minor points to stay ahead of rivals Fernando Alonso and Felipe Massa.

But under the new system, Alonso's second place at Interlagos last year would have given him enough points to leapfrog Vettel, while Massa's 2008 Brazilian GP victory would have denied Hamilton the championship on that occasion."

Still not biased towards Ferrari, are you Jean Todt?



In other news, apparently confirmed via autosport too, permanent driver numbers will be making a return from 2014 onwards. [www.autosport.com]

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I don't think it's any more gimmicky than the rule they had during the Prost-Senna era, where some of your races weren't included in your final points tally.

I can see why people don't like this rule, but I'm quite looking forward to it actually...

And, if Jean Todt was "still biased", then he wouldn't have let Pirelli change the tyres mid-season this year. He's probably the most neutral FIA president we've ever had, let's not forget that.

Also, it's been confirmed that there will be a budget cap from 2015. FINALLY!! And, yes, the permanent driver numbers have been confirmed, too. A day with a lot of news today

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You know you want to. [judgegrudge.mybrute.com]




Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/09/2013 08:27PM by flat tyre.

flat tyre Wrote:
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> I don't think it's any more gimmicky than the rule
> they had during the Prost-Senna era, where some of
> your races weren't included in your final points
> tally.
>
> I can see why people don't like this rule, but I'm
> quite looking forward to it actually...
>
> And, if Jean Todt was "still biased", then he
> wouldn't have let Pirelli change the tyres
> mid-season this year. He's probably the most
> neutral FIA president we've ever had, let's not
> forget that.

Wouldn't have phrased the Jean Todt comment about him being biased like I did if I was being serious I agree with what you're saying entirely, just found it amusing that Ferrari would have benefited if this rule had come in earlier

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Hehe, whoops, I'm awful when it comes to sarcasm on the internet couldn't spot it if it smacked me in the face!

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You know you want to. [judgegrudge.mybrute.com]

I dont understand why if they change the numbering system they make the drivers to choose it instead the teams. its better a Ferrari with 27 and 28 and not with a messy 5 and 41 or whatever.

F1 its trying to be a mix between moto gp and Nascar

Mixed feelings over the new rules. The budget cap is most welcome. However, the numbers idea is horrendous, I can see the point in the teams picking their numbers, but why drivers? As Frantic pointed out it's going to be messy to see a team running with 5 & 41. Even worse is double points in the last GP, why should Abu Dhabi next season give out more points than classic circuits like Spa, Monza and Silverstone? It just seems like it's all been ill thought out to me with no regard for the fans.



5 x WCC - S5, S6, S7, S8, S10 | 4 x WDC - S5 Nick van der Voort ; S6, S7, S8 Ed Greenhalgh | 2 x WTC - S6 Stuart Ingers; S8 Andrei Sevastian

When I first saw the notion of double points, I was confused, astounded, and I wanted to hate it.

Now? I'm beginning to love it. It's not about the circuit, the integrity of the sport, or the heritage of Formula 1, it's ALWAYS been about the spectacle. The thought of seeing two or three championship leaders do battle to collect every single point available is one that could bring a real finale to F1; a real thrilling, exciting spectacle on which to close the curtain on. Even further down the field, we'll see drivers striving to collect as many points as possible, and teams trying to introduce bulletproof reliability to their cars as they try their hardest to ensure that they don't miss out on potentially millions of pounds that each constructors' championship position brings.

I hope I'm not gonna be disappointed now!

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GPGSL: S6 - TafuroGP Tester (14th) /// S7 - ART Tester (6th) /// S8 - Demon Driver (13th) /// S9 - Demon/Snake Driver (13th) /// S10 - Snake Driver (???) ///]
"My ambition is handicapped by laziness" - Charles Bukowski

I'm sure doubling the points has benefits. However, a fluke result in the last race is doubled too. Especially in the midfield, this can mean a lot in the WCC standings. I can't see why a fluke in the last race should count double over a fluke in the 8th race. Sooner or later, this will produce unfair championship outcomes, like when Senna won with less points than Prost (?). If it's all about the entertainment, fine by me. But stop calling it a sport then. To me, it's become gimmicky to a level where the line between sport and entertainment has been crossed. I'll still watch every race, but I will bear in mind that it will not always be the best combination of athlete and material who wins in the end, which is one of the defining aspects of a sport to me.

I'm also not sure about the budget cap. While I'm all for cutting down costs, I'm very sceptical about policing it and teams will find workarounds by buying technology from an external company for $1 a year or something.

Not too keen on the numbers either. Though on the other hand, I'm very curious about who will choose what. And who will be brave enough to choose 13. Or 69.

Nickv Wrote:
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> Not too keen on the numbers either. Though on the
> other hand, I'm very curious about who will choose
> what. And who will be brave enough to choose 13.
> Or 69.

Kimi. Nuff said.

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they should double the length of the last race as well

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used to be GPGSL's Nick Heidfeld

Quite interesting that Williams, Sauber and Lotus aren't taking part in the new tyre test next week, all teams which apparently have varying degrees of financial concerns. The only established team taking part which had rumours regarding their health is Force India.

Marussia and Caterham might just have enough resources at such short notice, so I'll not read too much into them not turning up.

I agree with Autosport - I can live with the numbers and support the cost-cap, but the double points in theast race..... I've already given my thoughts on that!

"This is a concern. It effectively means that bad luck will be doubly devastating for any driver suffering an engine failure or being wiped out by a wayward rival in the final race.

What's more, by the end of '14 it's expected that numerous competitors will be juggling all manner of grid penalties for exceeding the permitted five engines, which could further distort what happens in the last race.

Overall, this is a worrying move and could pave the way for other 'event' races being given extra points status either for sporting, or commercial reasons. It could also lead to the 'wrong' driver winning a title purely because of external circumstances.

While arguably good for the show, this is a step too far for F1."

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GPGSL -
GPGSL-3 - Pizza Party Racing manager and driver
Nations Cup - Team Scotland manager



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/09/2013 11:17PM by smoglessbutton4.

It's a shame Brazil isn't the finale then. That track is a real lottery. Abu Dhabi is a Red Bull fest, so meh.


Jenson drives it like he owns it; Lewis drives it like he stole it