POWERHORSE Hungary HOTLAP

Let me remind you that you have to look at this incident from a totally neutral point of view.

korn_freak wont be able to because he has most to benfit from me being DQ'ed.

But everyone, look at these facts:

1. I lost time. If i had gained time then there would be no arguement - straight DQ, but i DID NOT gain time

2. It was a genuine mistake on my part not to think it might be illegal

And when making your decision, bare in mind that ok, i did go off the track but not on purpose, not to gain time, and in fact i lost time

There are 3 options for you to chose:

1. Let me off, and forget about the whole ordeal

2. Punish me with a 5 point penalty

3. Totally DQ me

Now, i dont see anything wrong with just letting me off, its not like i tried to cheat on purpose

but if it makes you all feel better then take 5 points off

and if i get DQ completley i think that is very very harsh, and i will do what Ralf Schumacher did and Appeal the decision.

it doesn't matter if its intenetional, or time was lost.

2 wheels weren't on the track = dq.



if the boot was on the other foot...?



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Tony

i understand b-tone, and i would not differ my view if this was fcarmo/villej/or neils lap.

look at RS - he took out rubens and kimi. - he was penalized immediately

but when he appealed and went to court he was let off.

so its all very well saying DQ due to not having 2 wheels on track, but look at the circumstances as well.

I'd say 3, so far.

I can't view the hotlap without u crashing paul, so I wonder how ur settings are. I don't want to say anything final yet before I've seen the real thing.

P.S: All the other HLs were ok, so I don't understand this

Looking at it, yes he took what could be classed as a shortcut, but in F1, if anyone did that, the time would not be banned.

So I think you should think to yourself. If, say, Raikkonen, was on a flyer round Hungary, and ran wide hence took to the gravel at that same position, but still got pole, would you complain? do you think that the FIA would DQ the lap? Personally I think not.

So my vote is that Paul should be Let off and the time should still stand.

P.S. I'm coming back in Spa! :D (Forgot to send in my Hungary time >_<




PSN/Xbox 360 ID - Ianwoollam

if kimi did what i did and got pole, then there is reason to complain and people could say it was faster

but this was not faster,

and if as you say someone like wilson in the jaguar did exactly what i did, his time would be allowed.

i would not see anyone trying to ban it because it was slower and a mistake.

ive seen it before in qualy.

After haveing watched the "real" thing, I've moderated my view. Now I'd say 2 because.

1: Yes, he's cutting the turn and goes on the inside with all for wheels off the track. Deemed illegal in the rules so he's in for a penalty. With black flag enabled it would most definatelly have been showed here.

2: But yes it's true what powerhorse says about doing it to gain time:
He's steering wheel is all the way to the right through the previous corner, and he doesn't straight it until on the gravel. So he didn't steer to the gravel intentionally.

3: He's not off the throttle through the gravel trap, but the speed drops a bit anyway of course.




I think a total disqualification is way too harsh. It's just a game and we do it because we like it a lot. It's nothing more to the winner that the honor of winning. And we're past the date set for contributing with laps so a 5 point off is the right to do I think.

But for the future, maybe a poll which kind of rules regarding the use of GP4 tweeker, driving aids etc could be ok, or what do you say guys?



Post Edited (08-27-03 13:08)

i would not see anyone trying to ban it because it was slower and a mistake

Thats what I meant!!!!! In F1 if someone cut the corner whilst on a flyer and dropped time in the third sector! But still got pole! Anyhow thats just my opinion.




PSN/Xbox 360 ID - Ianwoollam

also - if you look at my lap, that off gravel moment disturbs my concentration anyway and i mess up at the following corner etc.

thanks guys

if going thru the garvel caused you to go slower, why the hell did u send that lap in?!



Sim

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All Hail The New York Giants - Winners of Superbowl XXI, XXV and XLII!

"I'd love to know what goes on in that crazy head of yours sometimes, Sim..." - Locke Cole

because altho it cost me time in the final sector, it was my fastest time i managed

none of this would have happened, if my game did not crash when i tried to save a 1.11.841

"none of this would have happened, if my game did not crash when i tried to save a 1.11.841"


been there, done that

the rest of ur lap was great driving, though.

What's the rule?

"5. It is not allowed to cut distance by cutting corners. The driver should have 2 wheels on the track or vertically over the track at alltime. The track is asphalt, white lines and kerbs. This rule is applyed only to inside corners, when distance was cut, and for chicanes. Besides it is not allowed to touch walls for increased braking. Please refrain from sending in laps that you're not sure about yourself."

On this basis Paul would be DQ:ed- right?

1. Who started this thread?
2. Why did he start it?

1. Paul
2. To come clean about the issue.

Paul feels that we should show leniency, because although he broke the rule he did not gain- but rather lost- time. He wants acknowledgement for a really superb hotlap time taking into account the fact that he drove on the gravel.

This is a precedent and means that everytime a good lap comes up for consideration, a panel will have to assess whether or not the infringement of the rule gave an advantage.

The problem with this is that the major players here are all biased, that is to say they are all competing.

Now in this case, the people above Paul - Neil, Fabio and Ville - are most biased since they are all contenders for the championship. The next driver below Paul is 1 second away.

I suggest that those with most to lose, Neil, Fabio and Ville put their sportmanship to the test and decide on Paul's fate in this case. I have my own opinion, but it is cheap, since I have nothing to lose or gain.

I also suggest that for the future, Neil update the rule to read:

"5. It is not allowed to cut distance by cutting corners. The driver should have 2 wheels on the track or vertically over the track at alltime. The track is asphalt, white lines and kerbs. This rule is applyed only to inside corners, when distance was cut, and for chicanes. Besides it is not allowed to touch walls for increased braking. This rule is CATEGORICAL and no exceptions will be made on any grounds. Please refrain from sending in laps that you're not sure about yourself."

That's my suggestion.



Post Edited (08-27-03 15:02)

Larry
AMD 3000+,Epox EP-8RDA,Ram 1536mb 333 DDr, Rad 9800 pro omega 2.4.96, dx9b, Audigy, MOMO FF,winxp

thanks.

i just went into the chicane with too much speed and committment and all this happened!

its funny tho, as if i had missed my braking point for that first tight chicane and went onto the gravel, i doubt there would be any questions asked.

but because its the fast chicane............


how u doing in spa??

So far not too good. 1 47.1**.
Will start another session now, let's see.................

ahh the controversy

I feel the 5 points is enough of a penalty, he didnt mean to do it, he lost time so no big deal, but i am going to take larryM's wording and use that as the rule from NOW on. so if this happens again. well STIFF S H I T

I say a 5-point-penalty for Paul is enough!!!!

Again I say, I really did a greate lap, but when I watched it I saw it was illegal.... even losing time by touching the gravel a little bit on that fast chicane, my lap was pretty fast, but ILLEGAL!!!! So I gave up of that lap, and sent another one, a slower one, but legal this time!!!! That´s what powerhorse should have done, and if he comes out of this with no penalties at all, I´m gonna feel very upset and enjuried!!!!



Post Edited (08-27-03 17:09)


Now you CAN sponsor me, click picture and know how

Spa is at 1m49s114. Will try out a new setup sent to me by a certain friend I need all the help I can get. Cheers Paul.



Larry
AMD 3000+,Epox EP-8RDA,Ram 1536mb 333 DDr, Rad 9800 pro omega 2.4.96, dx9b, Audigy, MOMO FF,winxp

thats all right larry. your a mate.

anything you want to ask, just ask me!

i agree fcarmo.

i have learnt my lesson - it will NEVER happen again, i will send a clean lap in

I haven't seen Paul's lap, but I think is he had all 4-wheels off track then the lap should be illegal, anyway, total DQ seems too much, so I say for this time a 5-point penalty is the right thing, and the new rule that LarryM wrote should be included in the Rule Book.
So, 5-point penalty is my vote.

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I'm against sigpics