2011 Japanese GP **SPOILERS**

great podium, Suzuka always gives us great podiums of great drivers...

great win on Jenson, is a reward for the second half he's having, hopefully next year Mclaren can keep the same pace compared to his rivals and fight it out with Vettel and Ferrari...

Alonso finishing scond is amazing, never taught he was going to fight for the victory but he did, which shows the capabilities of his talent... he's definitely a great star still finishing where he's definitely not supposed to...

Vettel well, not much to say, he's done it all the whole year, this race was about clinching the title.. didn't quite work as he wanted to clinch it with a win but the two drivers who finished in front are having a great year too, so no shame in being beaten here by them..

Hamilton.. lol.. Massa... where did it all go wrong?, maybe the deflector did affected his performance contrary to Smedley's opinion?.. he was keeping his pace with Alonso in the first couple of stints.. anyway it seems to reflect this year for him basically.. and great job from Michael capitalizing on the safety car and beating him...

Perez... wow :O... oh, and Webber raced?.. jk.. that coming tgether with Schumacher was unnnecesary tough.. he needs to calm down, he was lucky he finished the race, the mistakes he's making might guarantee nex season to be his last with Red Bull... just a few races ago he was critizicing Jenson's talen.. maybe he needs a deep look in the mirror?

remember hamilton cant drive slower on new tyres and cant drive faster on old tyres.

The podium three were certainly the class of the field, as those 3 have been for much of the season and either of them would have deserved to win this race.

Button judged it to the finish beautifully, when Alonso was closing in towards the end I suspected that Button had maybe mismanaged his tyres in that final stint, yet it seems fuel was more of an issue and his sprint in the last 3 laps was a bit like holding a bit of candy out to a toddler and then yanking it out of their reach again and again.

Alonso as ever got more from that Ferrari than it was willing to give, slightly helped with it using it's tyres uncommonly well for once but hand him an inche and he'll grab a mile.

Only 3rd for our new youngest double world champ of the world. RBR's ominous long run advantage on Friday turned out to be the red herring I thought it might be and surprisingly they were outdone by Ferrari in the kindness to tyres competition, which nessicsted in early stops and the traffic which probably ultimately took this win away.

Webber... If he invisible? I don't think I noticed him the whole race etc when he tangled with Schumacher.

Hamilton and Massa, just wtf? They both really need to sort their @#$%& out. Yet another mindlessly clumsy move by Hamilton and I wonder how he was that far off the pace? As for for Massa, he needs to stfu and quickly. Yes he was unlucky to be yet again clobbered by Hamilton but his petulant crying about it is beginning to grate because he himself thinks nothing of nearly driving any car off the road which isn't pedalled by Alonso whenever anyone tries to overtake him.

NeilPearson Wrote:
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> remember hamilton cant drive slower on new tyres
> and cant drive faster on old tyres.


Nah, that's ultimately one of these popular F1 misconceptions which eventually get put to rights by a consummate victory. Rather like Vettle can't overtake or win from behind and Button can't win in the dry.

It's too easy to bash Hamilton for being hard on tyres... Just don't forget his win in China

I think he's referring to radio calls earlier in the season, where Hamilton was grumbling that he "can't drive any slower", and then in a subsequent race complained about not being able to go any faster on old rubber (the exact nature of the radio call I can't remember).

Hi folks,

It's a bit of an annual tradition for me to jump out of 'Lukerville' and post an impression at the end of a title fight.

Vettel has been great this year.....there's still so much to come from him it's scary; do you think he has 8 titles in him!? 2 down.....

Alonso is just the class of the field. He's been doing some fantastic work this year, and keeps out of trouble to boot. I really hope Ferrari give him a superb car next year, or at least one equal of the Red Bulls and Mclarens.

Button drove a solid race today. I really didn't believe in him early in his career but his performances are undeniably solid, so respect of an ambivalent spectator won. LOL at the post race waiting room! It's so cool of them to stuff a camera and mic in there! Even though the drivers know it's there (Alonso more than others!) they can't help themselves. Great viewing.

Is Hamilton sitting too low in the car? I don't really think anything dramatic is going there other than that thought.

It must be so galling for the field to see Vettel living the dream....I feel like an idiot when I sim race these days...'oh yeah fantasy boy!...Vettel was younger!' I'm sure it's how a part of Lewis feels!!

Was an ok race not really sure why Martin and DC thought it was fantastic tbh.

Not sure wtf is going through Lewis head at the moment, why take all year to say he cannot see in his mirrors. Bit shocked he got away with no drive through it was stupid and really dangerous.

Well done to Vettel deserved the championship he's hardly put a wheel wrong all year.

Great drive by JB, shame Lewis had that tyre problem as maybe he would have been 3rd or something.

Though the race was a bit crap...? Nothing whatsoever happened other than Hamilton hitting Massa. I think Vettel was lucky not to get a penalty, so was Hamilton.

To spice this racing up we need more retirements and stuff - it's too static at the minute where all the top three or four teams have to do it drive around for two hours and finish 1 - 8 leaving only two or three places for the rest to squabble for. Worse reliability would lead to lower teams scoring more off-kilter point scoring finishes. My point today is proven - both RBRs, Ferraris, Mclarens and Mercedes in top ten. Boring.

One interesting statistic is that Button has more than double the number of podiums that Hamilton has had so far in 2011. The score is 9 - 4. That's quite a damning difference in performance.

To spice this racing up we need more retirements and stuff

I agree with that, since FIA prohibited touching the cars between saturdays and sundays and with the engine freeze the grid is way too reliable... anyway i think that reliability will be over (at least for a year o two) in 2013 when turbo engines will be hitting the track (it would be awesome if we go back to the times when only 10 or 12 cars finished the race... i remember Monaco 1982, in the last two laps or so four or five drivers retired, after being each in the lead. i cant see that happening now )

I rarely have time to comment on the races but I disagree that it was boring. There was less artificial overtaking in the front, a good thing. I'm disappointed by the poor reaction here in this forum. Where are the top educated posters? A guy has just won a back to back title. Come on - say something.

It was not a boring race just was not as fantastic as they made out thats all I meant.

It was more like the last god knows how many years when pit stops made the difference.

When you look at the stats with JB and Lewis then yes Lewis has had a really bad year, but up until Italy Lewis was always ahead of JB in the races but he would do something to make sure it never finished that way lol. Even in Japan he was ahead until the tyre went down, not saying he would have won but he would not have had to race Nico and Massa and maybe would have got 3rd.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/09/2011 08:30PM by marcl.

Frantic Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> To spice this racing up we need more retirements
> and stuff
>
> I agree with that, since FIA prohibited touching
> the cars between saturdays and sundays and with
> the engine freeze the grid is way too reliable...
> anyway i think that reliability will be over (at
> least for a year o two) in 2013 when turbo engines
> will be hitting the track (it would be awesome if
> we go back to the times when only 10 or 12 cars
> finished the race... i remember Monaco 1982, in
> the last two laps or so four or five drivers
> retired, after being each in the lead. i cant see
> that happening now )

Not my kind of F1. As much as I enjoyed the 90s, I'm glad reliability is good nowadays. Whilst it's interesting to have unpredicted results, something of a novelty, it's not too satisfying when it comes about through random misfortune. Fisichella at Spa in 2009, Vettel at Monza in 2008, Hill at Hungary in 1997 (albeit aided by Frentzen's retirement), Perez's disqualified 7th in Melbourne, etc these are the kinds of races which I can appreciate for their bizarre yet earned outcomes. Maybe a win's a win, or a 5th place in a Minardi's a 5th place in a Minardi, but it's nothing much to be proud of IMO when it's simply inherited through car failures. It just seems strange to me to be "bored" of seeing results like today where the quickest drivers/cars are rewarded for being quickest. Isn't that what motorsport's about?

Fantastic race with loads of good, clean moves and the usual suspects n00bing up. Brilliant drives from Jenson, Fernando and of course Seb - brilliant back-to-back title win!
Great drive by MS as well, really strong performance. Di Resta really did a good job too.

Disappointing that Senna went backwards the way he did.

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If anyone's looking for that mini-movie (back to back champions) song that BBC played during the F1 Japan 2011 F1 Grand Prix Coverage, here it is:

&ob=av2e

....and the big bad wolf at Red Bull:



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elemental Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Frantic Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > To spice this racing up we need more
> retirements
> > and stuff
> >
> > I agree with that, since FIA prohibited
> touching
> > the cars between saturdays and sundays and with
> > the engine freeze the grid is way too
> reliable...
> > anyway i think that reliability will be over
> (at
> > least for a year o two) in 2013 when turbo
> engines
> > will be hitting the track (it would be awesome
> if
> > we go back to the times when only 10 or 12 cars
> > finished the race... i remember Monaco 1982, in
> > the last two laps or so four or five drivers
> > retired, after being each in the lead. i cant
> see
> > that happening now )
>
> Not my kind of F1. As much as I enjoyed the 90s,
> I'm glad reliability is good nowadays. Whilst it's
> interesting to have unpredicted results, something
> of a novelty, it's not too satisfying when it
> comes about through random misfortune. Fisichella
> at Spa in 2009, Vettel at Monza in 2008, Hill at
> Hungary in 1997 (albeit aided by Frentzen's
> retirement), Perez's disqualified 7th in
> Melbourne, etc these are the kinds of races which
> I can appreciate for their bizarre yet earned
> outcomes. Maybe a win's a win, or a 5th place in a
> Minardi's a 5th place in a Minardi, but it's
> nothing much to be proud of IMO when it's simply
> inherited through car failures. It just seems
> strange to me to be "bored" of seeing results like
> today where the quickest drivers/cars are rewarded
> for being quickest. Isn't that what motorsport's
> about?

you´re right, but what I was trying to say is that is better not having all the field as reliable as it is nowdays. is bad to have so poor reliability too, the best thing is an equilibrium... im not saying that every race has to have a HRT in the points but every once in a while its nice to see an unexpected result due to a front´s car failure... when was the last time we have had a blown engine during a race? Alonso in Sepang 2010? it is a long time...
Another thing your post made me realize is that today the front running cars are way too ahead of the midfield cars and the fact that teams like Renault dont have a very good driver makes the chance of having a strange result even lower... Imagine what a renault can do in hands of Rosberg or Alonso or Vettel. And im saying Rosberg because I think Mercedes have a very poor car driven by 2 awesome drivers

I agree it's much better to see a weaker car getting points on merit. The two tyre companies in 1997 helped a lot with that. With midfield and smaller teams running Bridgestone against the dominant Goodyear meant that now and again the likes of Panis/Trulli and Hill could get their cars near the front. There are many factors that help a struggling car near the front. Some drivers just seem to be good at certain circuits. Berger at Hockenheim in cars that didn't win any other race during the season is a good example. Weather of course has also been a major factor...Mansell at Silverstone in 88 is the best example I can think of there. So we don't need more retirements....always in F1 there will be other circumstances that shake things up. Then there's Leyton House....who could randomly go from challenging for a podium to not qualifying from race to race....

hadn't watched the "incident in qualy" until now...

just a tought.. Hamilton in Singapour passed Massa because in his own words he was "ready to go"... totally downplayed the maneuver, and i remember clearly there was enough time for everybody...

but here, he totally slow down with few seconds to go... he got overtaken by the other guys who where coming faster as they knew time was running out and he calls it "dangerous"?... pffffffff

He was told not to back up... was he trying to prevent Webber and Schu to do a timed lap?... and maybe he was mad because it backfired?

For me Lewis has an element of Jean Alesi about him - an amazingly good driver who's also flawed, and seems unable to develop and dial out his flaws as he gains experience.

---

The thing was Alesi, even with rose-tinted glasses, wasn't really that good. He was 60% emotion, 30% flamboyancy, 10% driver.

I loved Alesi to bits, but the only thing he shares with Hamilton is their ability to attract trouble (or inability to avoid it). A closer match to Alesi would be Kobayashi (though with the emotion and flamboyancy switched).

On a related (ish) note, did anyone else see that picture of the Sauber garage after Perez's move out of the hairpin and wonder what Alesi was doing in Sauber overalls?

For me, Lewis Hamilton is the same category as Jacques Villeneuve... Way too many similarities (apart from dads)!

____