GPGSL Rules and Regulations Discussion Thread
Posted by GPGSL
1) C
2) As long as we keep the current race distance, 2 stops shouldn't produce much more work for the RD. But considering how often JW only stopped once in the last two seasons, I think we should stick with one stop races.
3) C
4) Increase the boosts to 100 and a fix variance of 400
5) I'd prefer keeping 2 tyre suppliers. But if we go for the boost coloring, please with a vote for the supplier including all members.
Some F1 CSM mods
1996 | 2000 | 2002 | 2007 | 2011 | 2013 | 2015 | 2018
2) As long as we keep the current race distance, 2 stops shouldn't produce much more work for the RD. But considering how often JW only stopped once in the last two seasons, I think we should stick with one stop races.
3) C
4) Increase the boosts to 100 and a fix variance of 400
5) I'd prefer keeping 2 tyre suppliers. But if we go for the boost coloring, please with a vote for the supplier including all members.
Some F1 CSM mods
1996 | 2000 | 2002 | 2007 | 2011 | 2013 | 2015 | 2018
I want to add a little idea to end the season in a high: Another special GP at Abu Dhabi (or other track) with drivers in different teams, like last season. It was very entertaining!
Stats: 139 Starts / 7 Wins / 9 Poles / 5 Fastest laps
Stats: 139 Starts / 7 Wins / 9 Poles / 5 Fastest laps
It seemed a little pointless in my opinion.
I'd rather see some pre-season tests as we used to have.
While they didn't count towards the perfs they were a nice way of breaking up the post season and it was always good to see drivers who had moved making a start in their new teams.
Races: 163 - Wins: 23 - Pole Positions: 24 - Fastest Laps: 22
Season 9: Constructors' Champions
I'd rather see some pre-season tests as we used to have.
While they didn't count towards the perfs they were a nice way of breaking up the post season and it was always good to see drivers who had moved making a start in their new teams.
Races: 163 - Wins: 23 - Pole Positions: 24 - Fastest Laps: 22
Season 9: Constructors' Champions
That is interesting data and very appreciated, since it saves me from having to do it myself 
So, there a some points, however, which should be kept in thought.
1.) You took the starter perf where people are very close together. So while the effect might be a little drastic at the start, it won't be this influential anymore once the season progresses.
2.) As you already pointed out, other people will use boosts, too, thereby leveling the effect as well
3.) The first round doesn't allow boosts, but it's a strategic option to try and use a boost for the second race to gain an advantage from it. However, if too many people do that, the boost loses its effect again.
So, I think the 100 points value is a good mix. Your data proves that it has a notable effect when it's used for only one driver and I think it works best with the variance decrease to 500 points.
GPGSL : Team Owner of 'Maverick Track Performance' (MTP)
So, there a some points, however, which should be kept in thought.
1.) You took the starter perf where people are very close together. So while the effect might be a little drastic at the start, it won't be this influential anymore once the season progresses.
2.) As you already pointed out, other people will use boosts, too, thereby leveling the effect as well
3.) The first round doesn't allow boosts, but it's a strategic option to try and use a boost for the second race to gain an advantage from it. However, if too many people do that, the boost loses its effect again.
So, I think the 100 points value is a good mix. Your data proves that it has a notable effect when it's used for only one driver and I think it works best with the variance decrease to 500 points.
GPGSL : Team Owner of 'Maverick Track Performance' (MTP)
I agree the test is very rough, the reasons for using the starter perf were 1) to show what the most extreme effect of boost would be, as its the extreme results put under scrutiny normally and 2) because its on the first page of the thread and i couldn't be bothered to dig through for an up to date version that had no boost usage 
.
I agree, a 100 boost with 500 variance seems to be the way to go. At least that way if its not working its either due to everyone using it or a really unlucky day, so shouldn't be too regular.
_________________________________________________
For a list of EVERY download for GP4, look here: [docs.google.com]
.I agree, a 100 boost with 500 variance seems to be the way to go. At least that way if its not working its either due to everyone using it or a really unlucky day, so shouldn't be too regular.
_________________________________________________
For a list of EVERY download for GP4, look here: [docs.google.com]
If you needed an up to date perf without boosts, I could have supplied you with one in no time at all 
5 x WCC - S5, S6, S7, S8, S10 | 4 x WDC - S5 Nick van der Voort ; S6, S7, S8 Ed Greenhalgh | 2 x WTC - S6 Stuart Ingers; S8 Andrei Sevastian
5 x WCC - S5, S6, S7, S8, S10 | 4 x WDC - S5 Nick van der Voort ; S6, S7, S8 Ed Greenhalgh | 2 x WTC - S6 Stuart Ingers; S8 Andrei Sevastian
I say get rid of boosts completely. It makes it easier for the mod makers and I don't think it would have too much of an overall effect on the season as a whole.
GPGSL - Christel VXR team Boss S6-S8, S12 Onwards
GPGSL - Christel VXR team Boss S6-S8, S12 Onwards
Without their large allocation of boost, One and Demon would be both be in the bottom reaches of the league.
The boost is effective, its just definitive on luck and chance and a huge amount of randomness from GP4.
Chris I get the feeling that you'd like the boost to be a definite thing, as in if you use 4bhp in a race, you will fight for the top 5.
I'd personally not like that at. Sure when I allocate some boost for MPR I hope it does do that, but if it was a definite that I'd then finish in the top 5 it'd make the boost boring.
I also don't think there really is a way to make it a certainty in GP4.
Races: 163 - Wins: 23 - Pole Positions: 24 - Fastest Laps: 22
Season 9: Constructors' Champions
The boost is effective, its just definitive on luck and chance and a huge amount of randomness from GP4.
Chris I get the feeling that you'd like the boost to be a definite thing, as in if you use 4bhp in a race, you will fight for the top 5.
I'd personally not like that at. Sure when I allocate some boost for MPR I hope it does do that, but if it was a definite that I'd then finish in the top 5 it'd make the boost boring.
I also don't think there really is a way to make it a certainty in GP4.
Races: 163 - Wins: 23 - Pole Positions: 24 - Fastest Laps: 22
Season 9: Constructors' Champions
EricMoinet écrivait:
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> 4- Keep the current boost format as it is for
> teams but change the format for drivers to 100
> boost and a variance of 500. Don't change the
> number of drivers boost, that's good like that.
> Allowing less boosts for drivers would give them
> less possibilities to influence their race.
>
Sorry to quote myself but I would like to alter this part, especially the team part :
The starting perfs and the pyramidal boost system are good IMO, but we may probably have to lower down the formulae for the performance points gained after each race, so that the advantage is not too high for the best teams and those teams getting higher and higher race after race. As GP4 is more based on teams performances than drivers perf a less gained perf points for teams after each race should minimize the chance to have a one runner series and to have new teams going on a high rate perf too easilly (my new boss will kill me for that... )
On the feeder series note, as I have myself a team in the (very long) waiting list I wouldn't mind to have one, but make it a standalone series with shorter races and, say, a 10-12 races championship so that it will take less time to run it. No relegation system needed : when a team withdraw of the main series, the first team in the actual waiting list takes its place as we do currently.
This series could easily replace the Testers series as we have quite enough test drivers in it that could take place in the new teams. However, I'm not a big fan of the feeder teams linked to the main teams. I can understand that team owners want to build their long term strategies by keeping an eye on their test drivers, but I think there could be some other ways to do it without going in a compulsary linking teams.
Off course, this series should be run on its own with some other people running it so it won't interfer with the main series and won't give more job to the actual RD of the main series. I like the idea of the GP2 style series even if i would prefer to have different tracks and different venues like it was in the F2/F3000 era. This way the main series won't have to wait that the feeder race has to be run (standalone I said ).
Just my two cents for the league.
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> 4- Keep the current boost format as it is for
> teams but change the format for drivers to 100
> boost and a variance of 500. Don't change the
> number of drivers boost, that's good like that.
> Allowing less boosts for drivers would give them
> less possibilities to influence their race.
>
Sorry to quote myself but I would like to alter this part, especially the team part :
The starting perfs and the pyramidal boost system are good IMO, but we may probably have to lower down the formulae for the performance points gained after each race, so that the advantage is not too high for the best teams and those teams getting higher and higher race after race. As GP4 is more based on teams performances than drivers perf a less gained perf points for teams after each race should minimize the chance to have a one runner series and to have new teams going on a high rate perf too easilly (my new boss will kill me for that...
)On the feeder series note, as I have myself a team in the (
This series could easily replace the Testers series as we have quite enough test drivers in it that could take place in the new teams. However, I'm not a big fan of the feeder teams linked to the main teams. I can understand that team owners want to build their long term strategies by keeping an eye on their test drivers, but I think there could be some other ways to do it without going in a compulsary linking teams.
Off course, this series should be run on its own with some other people running it so it won't interfer with the main series and won't give more job to the actual RD of the main series. I like the idea of the GP2 style series even if i would prefer to have different tracks and different venues like it was in the F2/F3000 era. This way the main series won't have to wait that the feeder race has to be run (standalone I said
).Just my two cents for the league.
I'll be honest my main interest in a feeder series would be as a talent pool and yes, I'd most likely look to do a deal with a team to work in partnership to find the very best drivers in that pool.
My only worry about a feeder series would be, one the workload, two a lack of drivers for the feeder series and three a knock-on affect on the main series if you were to say introduce a rule so that drivers in the main series could not own a team in the feeder series and still race.
As I've said before, the tests series looks full up but it is still made up of an abundance of team owners, as of now only me and Chris Copeman don't test. With JHR set to replace Christel it will be just me who has stopped testing and even then I've returned to keep my perf safe. 13 of the testers don't own a team so it's a close run thing. You'd struggle to fill any seats in a feeder series right now.
I'm also curious as to how the two original GPG leagues exactly worked together, in effect, was one a feeder series, or was the second set up up to account for the overspill of the first?
Lessons to be learnt there.
Races: 163 - Wins: 23 - Pole Positions: 24 - Fastest Laps: 22
Season 9: Constructors' Champions
My only worry about a feeder series would be, one the workload, two a lack of drivers for the feeder series and three a knock-on affect on the main series if you were to say introduce a rule so that drivers in the main series could not own a team in the feeder series and still race.
As I've said before, the tests series looks full up but it is still made up of an abundance of team owners, as of now only me and Chris Copeman don't test. With JHR set to replace Christel it will be just me who has stopped testing and even then I've returned to keep my perf safe. 13 of the testers don't own a team so it's a close run thing. You'd struggle to fill any seats in a feeder series right now.
I'm also curious as to how the two original GPG leagues exactly worked together, in effect, was one a feeder series, or was the second set up up to account for the overspill of the first?
Lessons to be learnt there.
Races: 163 - Wins: 23 - Pole Positions: 24 - Fastest Laps: 22
Season 9: Constructors' Champions
As Dan has pointed out already, the feeder series faces a bunch of problems. Another one that hasn't been pointed out even, yet, is how to handle perfs if the feeder series only drives 10 or 12 races?! That means a massive disadvantage for feeder series drivers compared to main series drivers. And how do you keep those people active during the necessarily occurring waiting times? In my opinion this isn't really working out. We have a well running tester championship and people on the waiting list CAN show off their liveries if they manage to get the interest of a main series team owner for it. It's purely aesthetic, but at least a start.
GPGSL : Team Owner of 'Maverick Track Performance' (MTP)
GPGSL : Team Owner of 'Maverick Track Performance' (MTP)
How about keeping just a single series, but the test teams become their own entities. Part of the same series but only taking part in sessions on 'Friday'. I'd be happy to give up my test team to someone else who fancies being a team boss, as long as they were willing to keep me involved as a partner.
The only issue with this idea is that each test team would quickly become a junior partner to one of the main teams, in which case we may as well not bother Just countered my own idea.
Races: 163 - Wins: 23 - Pole Positions: 24 - Fastest Laps: 22
Season 9: Constructors' Champions
The only issue with this idea is that each test team would quickly become a junior partner to one of the main teams, in which case we may as well not bother
Just countered my own idea.Races: 163 - Wins: 23 - Pole Positions: 24 - Fastest Laps: 22
Season 9: Constructors' Champions
Some nice thoughts here
Ferrari2007 écrivait:
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I'll be honest my main interest in a feeder series would be as a talent pool and yes, I'd most likely look to do a deal with a team to work in partnership to find the very best drivers in that pool.
That doesn't meen necessary that the team are linked IMO. There could be some agreements between teams as well.
My only worry about a feeder series would be, one the workload
Yes, that's my main worry too. I hope enough people would like to run this series aside from the main one.
two a lack of drivers for the feeder series
In my mind, team owners have the ability to drive so there is no issue there, except if they don't want to drive in a feeder series but prefer to drive in a tester series.
and three a knock-on affect on the main series if you were to say introduce a rule so that drivers in the main series could not own a team in the feeder series and still race.
Please, don't do that ! If I'm correct that rule was implemented to make an easier access to the main series for test drivers. If we do the same for the feeder series, we probably have only team owners of the main series and the feeder series driving in it. Maybe we will have to redraw this rule if we go into a feeder series. But honestly I don't know how.
JohnMaverick écrivait:
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As Dan has pointed out already, the feeder series faces a bunch of problems. Another one that hasn't been pointed out even, yet, is how to handle perfs if the feeder series only drives 10 or 12 races?! That means a massive disadvantage for feeder series drivers compared to main series drivers.
I'm not sure it's really an issue. That's the same in real life. When a driver jumps from GP2 to F1 most of the time he gets a disadvantage compared to the other drivers. Plus usually he gets an offer from a smaller team which doubles the disadvantage regarding his chance to get a good result in a short time. He has to build up his skill before getting the opportunity to have a better seat.
And how do you keep those people active during the necessarily occurring waiting times? In my opinion this isn't really working out.
Good point here. In my mind it was to make the series easier to run with less races. Maybe not the best way to do it.
We have a well running tester championship and people on the waiting list CAN show off their liveries if they manage to get the interest of a main series team owner for it. It's purely aesthetic, but at least a start.
Not yet implemented, we are still discussing the posssibilities. So they CAN't do it yet. And for my part I'm not sure to be interested to enter a team just for aestetic purposes.
It would be interresting to see what other people think of all of this, the old guys in the place but also those having a team in the list and seing that they will have a slot maybe not before 4 or 5 years.
Ferrari2007 écrivait:
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I'll be honest my main interest in a feeder series would be as a talent pool and yes, I'd most likely look to do a deal with a team to work in partnership to find the very best drivers in that pool.
That doesn't meen necessary that the team are linked IMO. There could be some agreements between teams as well.
My only worry about a feeder series would be, one the workload
Yes, that's my main worry too. I hope enough people would like to run this series aside from the main one.
two a lack of drivers for the feeder series
In my mind, team owners have the ability to drive so there is no issue there, except if they don't want to drive in a feeder series but prefer to drive in a tester series.
and three a knock-on affect on the main series if you were to say introduce a rule so that drivers in the main series could not own a team in the feeder series and still race.
Please, don't do that !
If I'm correct that rule was implemented to make an easier access to the main series for test drivers. If we do the same for the feeder series, we probably have only team owners of the main series and the feeder series driving in it. Maybe we will have to redraw this rule if we go into a feeder series. But honestly I don't know how.JohnMaverick écrivait:
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As Dan has pointed out already, the feeder series faces a bunch of problems. Another one that hasn't been pointed out even, yet, is how to handle perfs if the feeder series only drives 10 or 12 races?! That means a massive disadvantage for feeder series drivers compared to main series drivers.
I'm not sure it's really an issue. That's the same in real life. When a driver jumps from GP2 to F1 most of the time he gets a disadvantage compared to the other drivers. Plus usually he gets an offer from a smaller team which doubles the disadvantage regarding his chance to get a good result in a short time. He has to build up his skill before getting the opportunity to have a better seat.
And how do you keep those people active during the necessarily occurring waiting times? In my opinion this isn't really working out.
Good point here. In my mind it was to make the series easier to run with less races. Maybe not the best way to do it.
We have a well running tester championship and people on the waiting list CAN show off their liveries if they manage to get the interest of a main series team owner for it. It's purely aesthetic, but at least a start.
Not yet implemented, we are still discussing the posssibilities. So they CAN't do it yet. And for my part I'm not sure to be interested to enter a team just for aestetic purposes.
It would be interresting to see what other people think of all of this, the old guys in the place but also those having a team in the list and seing that they will have a slot maybe not before 4 or 5 years.
Eric, in RL drivers have other possibilities to improve their driving skills. In GPGSL they haven't. Nobody would be interested to drive in a feeder series that doesn't give him good chances to improve the perf. That's what the current - and well working - test races are there for.
And the waiting list team/test team mix isn't fully implemented, yet, but there is no rule that prevents doing it! If teams wanna do it, there's nobody to stop them. Since these teams don't gain any advantage because of it, that's all fine.
However, although I skipped my chance to bring in a team before, I'm again at a top stop on the waiting list. I can happen that people would have to wait very long for a full entrance, but it's not a given thing.
As somebody who is currently on the waiting list, I completely don't mind being there. I enjoy my time as a driver in the meantime. If I got the chance to bring my waiting list team into the test series, I'd probably do it. But I'm completely not a fan of implementing a badly worked out feeder series and destroy a well working test championship just to have the feeder series (and a bunch of upcoming problems).
GPGSL : Team Owner of 'Maverick Track Performance' (MTP)
And the waiting list team/test team mix isn't fully implemented, yet, but there is no rule that prevents doing it! If teams wanna do it, there's nobody to stop them. Since these teams don't gain any advantage because of it, that's all fine.
However, although I skipped my chance to bring in a team before, I'm again at a top stop on the waiting list. I can happen that people would have to wait very long for a full entrance, but it's not a given thing.
As somebody who is currently on the waiting list, I completely don't mind being there. I enjoy my time as a driver in the meantime. If I got the chance to bring my waiting list team into the test series, I'd probably do it. But I'm completely not a fan of implementing a badly worked out feeder series and destroy a well working test championship just to have the feeder series (and a bunch of upcoming problems).
GPGSL : Team Owner of 'Maverick Track Performance' (MTP)
For what it's worth
1 - C
2 - One stop races are fine
3 - B
4 - I'm all for upping the driver boosts, however personally I've never been a fan of the pyramid system for team boosts.
5 - Again I vote against this. Whilst it sounds like a neat idea, I personally don't think it adds anything valuable plus it does kinda screw over the teams who were happy with Bridgestone.
Also, on the subjected on a feeder series, for me it's a big no-no. As it is we barely have enough RDs for the main series, never mind for running two series side by side.
EricMoinet Wrote:
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> As GP4 is more based on teams performances than drivers
> perf a less gained perf points for teams after
> each race should minimize the chance to have a one
> runner series and to have new teams going on a
> high rate perf too easilly (my new boss will kill
> me for that... )
Actually Eric I agree with you!
If I'd been in Glen or Rod shoes this season and been met with almost instant success, to be honest I'd have been a little disappointed. However, I think their success was more down to a combination of the pyramid boost scheme and the one lap quali system more than anything.
Interested in managing an F1 team? Sign up for the Grandprixgames F1 Manager game here
1 - C
2 - One stop races are fine
3 - B
4 - I'm all for upping the driver boosts, however personally I've never been a fan of the pyramid system for team boosts.
5 - Again I vote against this. Whilst it sounds like a neat idea, I personally don't think it adds anything valuable plus it does kinda screw over the teams who were happy with Bridgestone.
Also, on the subjected on a feeder series, for me it's a big no-no. As it is we barely have enough RDs for the main series, never mind for running two series side by side.
EricMoinet Wrote:
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> As GP4 is more based on teams performances than drivers
> perf a less gained perf points for teams after
> each race should minimize the chance to have a one
> runner series and to have new teams going on a
> high rate perf too easilly (my new boss will kill
> me for that...
)Actually Eric I agree with you!
If I'd been in Glen or Rod shoes this season and been met with almost instant success, to be honest I'd have been a little disappointed. However, I think their success was more down to a combination of the pyramid boost scheme and the one lap quali system more than anything.
Interested in managing an F1 team? Sign up for the Grandprixgames F1 Manager game here
Twigster151 Wrote:
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>
> If I'd been in Glen or Rod shoes this season and
> been met with almost instant success, to be honest
> I'd have been a little disappointed. However, I
> think their success was more down to a combination
> of the pyramid boost scheme and the one lap quali
> system more than anything.
And because their drivers were just awesome...
GPGSL: S6 - TafuroGP Tester (14th) /// S7 - ART Tester (6th) /// S8 - Demon Driver (13th) /// S9 - Demon/Snake Driver (13th) /// S10 - Snake Driver (???) ///]
"My ambition is handicapped by laziness" - Charles Bukowski
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>
> If I'd been in Glen or Rod shoes this season and
> been met with almost instant success, to be honest
> I'd have been a little disappointed. However, I
> think their success was more down to a combination
> of the pyramid boost scheme and the one lap quali
> system more than anything.
And because their drivers were just awesome...
GPGSL: S6 - TafuroGP Tester (14th) /// S7 - ART Tester (6th) /// S8 - Demon Driver (13th) /// S9 - Demon/Snake Driver (13th) /// S10 - Snake Driver (???) ///]
"My ambition is handicapped by laziness" - Charles Bukowski
Badly worked out feeder series ??? You are going miles too far !
We are just discussing the pros and cons of a possible new series. Nothing worked out yet, just dropping some ideas to discuss with (and I've been answering to some of the "bunch of problems" mentionned).
As I said the main issue is : will we have enough people to run a new series ? On the other hand, if there is a standalone feeder series instead of a tester series, there will be less work to run the main series, so potentially more room to run a new one.
We are just discussing the pros and cons of a possible new series. Nothing worked out yet, just dropping some ideas to discuss with (and I've been answering to some of the "bunch of problems" mentionned).
As I said the main issue is : will we have enough people to run a new series ? On the other hand, if there is a standalone feeder series instead of a tester series, there will be less work to run the main series, so potentially more room to run a new one.
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