A Serious question on how we, and the FIA judge drivers (Contains Korean GP Spoilers)

In Alonso´s case it is probably a bit different as he really does have a problem with media. He is completely different with the British media then the Spanish and probably Italian now. He said in an interview once that (and I can´t remember his exact words) the British media are the people most disruptive to his career. Obviously if he seems a bit offish in interviews or whatever, people are going to build opinions based on that, hence why a lot of people (mainly British) don´t like for him. Once you don´t like somebody it´s very easy to find faults and blame them. Perfect example in this thread;

To be fair, he's right there. The abuse which was posted about him was a disgrace. The British media in general is an embarrassment. If Lewis wasn't British and great at the PR Game then he'd say the same about the last few years, where he couldn't leave his house without a squad of cameras following him.

And yeah, Hamilton has been in his fair share of scandals, in a short time. Alonso didn't have much to do with the Albert Park fiasco did he?

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Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/25/2010 11:26PM by DaveEllis.

That's all and well, but if that happened to say Ferrari, do you think the Italian media wouldn't do the same? Or any other national media with their home team being held to ransom by someone not getting what he wants?




LS's Tip of the week
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Of course they would. For the record, I am not saying any particular nation/media group or whatever is right or wrong, more that we (the general public) base our opinions on what we see/hear/read and they control that.

I don't know about with motor-racing, but ironically last night 5 Live had a British reporter (who works on Spanish football) commenting how different our respective media are approaching our World Cup bids.

The English media are generally behind our bid and in the mainstream media the only reports on rival bids are if there are controversies.

In Spain they have apparently all but given up on their own bid - there is very little reporting on their bid at all, and that's the way it's been for ages now.

While it's easy to think that the situation in another country is similar to your own, it's rarely the same.

The British media are notoriously crass. They're hounding everyone constantly, they're obsessed with the celebrity and if they don't have a story they'll simply make one up. The broadsheets aren't so bad, but the sensationalist tabloids are awful.

Using another football analogy, look at when Luiz Felipe Scolari was offered the England job - he came to England, was on the verge of signing, then when FA released a statement, half the country's media landed on his hotel doorstep and he instantly changed his mind claiming "intrusive publicity" and went back to Portugal. Of course he became Chelsea manager later, but still, he was damning of the English media hoards.

LS. Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> That's all and well, but if that happened to say
> Ferrari, do you think the Italian media wouldn't
> do the same? Or any other national media with
> their home team being held to ransom by someone
> not getting what he wants?


So if one set is bad as another then that makes it ok? Two wrongs make a right?

Alonso was treated like @#$%& by the British press just for having the nerve to disagree with Hamilton. He has the right to dislike the British press. Hell, we all hate them, just we seem to pick and chose what arguments we apply and when depending on the driver. Alonso gets a particularly harsh deal from British fans, who gloss over the same offenses when they are committed by Hamilton.

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The F1 media in general is pretty fair, the tabloids are a different matter.

I don't think that's specifically a British problem, from what I hear the Bild is the same, and the Italian media get hysterical about anything Ferrari related.




LS's Tip of the week
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I only read tabloid crap to laugh at how insanely mis-guided and crap it is. A few years ago I noticed that the Sun and probably others used to copy and rehash stuff from F1 Racing a few months after it originally published and try to pass it off a it's own.

Since then I've never taken the tabloid reports seriously, and I imagine that most of the reporters have never been near an F1 paddock or person in their life.

And given how much crap the media in general produces it's no wonder that the like of Alonso etc spend most of their time avoiding them, I'd do the same if much of my working day (or worse life) was interrupted by dullard reporters and some lesser extent photographers (the later of which I'm guilty of :P and I know just how elusive Alonso, Raikkonen, Schumacher, Villeneuve etc are.)

LS. Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The F1 media in general is pretty fair, the
> tabloids are a different matter.
>
> I don't think that's specifically a British
> problem, from what I hear the Bild is the same,
> and the Italian media get hysterical about
> anything Ferrari related.

Yup. But you're missing the point. You criticise Alonso for disliking the British media. But out of all of the national medias, the British media were the ones giving him the abuse. So surely he is within his right to dislike the British media. If he was racing, for example, Kubica, and had a massive rivalry with him, and the Polish media was giving him the abuse then he'd be saying the same about them. Any driver would. It's just yet another perfect example of what this thread was about - how we judge different drivers differently, sometimes based on personal preference. I really should have talked about Alonso and the abuse he has received for almost everything he has done, whether he is correct or not. This actually has nothing to do with the media, but simply F1 viewers.

This thread has ended up throwing up perfect examples I forgot about, completely by accident.

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I haven't critised Alonso for disliking the British media, he's entitled to dislike them after the tabloids have jumped on the bandwagon

My point is you can't have a pop at our media when the same thing happens in other countries, it would be interesting to read what the Spanish tabloid media made of the Hamilton/Mclaren/Alonso situation

We saw the how the fans reacted to Lewis Hamilton by blacking up and abusing him, I don't recall such reactions to that degree at Lewis,s home gp.

Media plays a major part in this kind of thing, sensationalising stuff to the masses, yet the real fans and circuit based F1 media know differently

It's just when the tabloids get to work that issues arise

I personally don't have anything against any driver currently in F1, it's been a cracking season and I wish it were a bit longer to draw out the suspense of knowing who will triumph




LS's Tip of the week
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Considering how Alonso was treated in Germany by the british press, I think that what you can expect from him is that dislike.
The spanish press was quite aggressive on Lewis and (specially) McLaren in 2007.
But I don't remember any spanish reporter asking Lewis (or anyone) in the way the British press was asking Alonso in Germany when he was not really the full responsible for what happened. I really think that was a lack of education. Also, Nobody on the spanish press (as far as I have read) have insulted Hamilton in any way but I read some british headlines after Germany and many of them incurred in the personal insult to Alonso. I have to admit that I was surprised by that, honestly. It seems they are waiting for any opportunity (no matter how tiny it is) to attack Alonso.

Besides, (and this can be applied to myself) Spanish press was not very keen on Hamilton back in 2007 and 2008 but little by little that perception changed. They will never love him, but people admire him and respect (as an example, the reporters broadcasting the race in Korea were hailing him for being so brave saying that the conditions were OK, the track was for intermediates, the light was OK...). Not even with the incident in Valencia with the SC the press was so abusive with Lewis (The target was the race stewards) than how the brits were with Alonso in Germany... .

Ali Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Considering how Alonso was treated in Germany by
> the british press, I think that what you can
> expect from him is that dislike.
> The spanish press was quite aggressive on Lewis
> and (specially) McLaren in 2007.
> But I don't remember any spanish reporter asking
> Lewis (or anyone) in the way the British press was
> asking Alonso in Germany when he was not really
> the full responsible for what happened. I really
> think that was a lack of education. Also, Nobody
> on the spanish press (as far as I have read) have
> insulted Hamilton in any way but I read some
> british headlines after Germany and many of them
> incurred in the personal insult to Alonso. I have
> to admit that I was surprised by that, honestly.
> It seems they are waiting for any opportunity (no
> matter how tiny it is) to attack Alonso.

that's been clear since Bahrain and China... they where creating a lot of rumors about Felipe not being happy with Alonso's maneuvers and that there was tension and this and that, and it all turned out to be BS... they stopped, and then found a perfect opportunity to point the finger on Alonso in Hockem..., and still their relationships seems intact, they where both joking around and smiling in Korea

> In Spain they have apparently all but given up on
> their own bid - there is very little reporting on
> their bid at all, and that's the way it's been for
> ages now.

I didn´t even know Spain had a bid in, but I knew England did, so there is your answer.

I agree completely with what Ali said.

@LS maybe you have misunderstood my point - I wasn´t having a pop at anyone in particular, just using that as the best example I could think of. Of course it will happen in other countries, to same extent I don´t know, I only have experience with the British and Spanish press/media. The whole point is that Alonso´s persona will appear different to the British as it will to the Spanish and Vettel will appear different to the Germans as he does to say the Italians and so on. We only see the drivers how our chosen country decides we see them (unless you yoube foriegn videos or something).

I read all the time on here about the British Media fawning over our drivers ( which is true with the tabloids) but the proper F1 media try and feature balanced views and features on other drivers, but its over looked that other media do this for their own specific driver and that doesnt seem to get mentioned.

Its seem the British Media are getting it all the time, when it happens in other countrys and it doesnt reflect a balanced view of a global sport in general.

To anyone else according to this forum they would be forgiven thinking only the British Media hypes its own drivers and comes down like a ton of bricks on their rivals, when clearly it doesnt

Thats all im saying




LS's Tip of the week
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Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/26/2010 10:44PM by LS..

My point is you can't have a pop at our media when the same thing happens in other countries, it would be interesting to read what the Spanish tabloid media made of the Hamilton/Mclaren/Alonso situation

But this discussion is about Alonso, not me, you, BillyBob or Obama. It's about Alonso and his experiences. In his experiences the British media is worse. So he said it. So yes, he CAN have a pop at our media. We all agree that other medias such too, but Alonso hasn't been affected by them as much. If he'd pissed off Schumacher to the extreme that he did Lewis then I'm sure he'd be saying that about the Bild too.

So yeah, he can say that. They can all say that about whichever national media has made there lives more difficult than they should be.

The whole point is that Alonso´s persona will appear different to the British as it will to the Spanish and Vettel will appear different to the Germans as he does to say the Italians and so on. We only see the drivers how our chosen country decides we see them (unless you yoube foriegn videos or something).

Unfortunately British fans, especially the Lewis crew, have already made there own decision about Alonso, no matter what is reported, or even what he does. Alonso could cure cancer and rescue a wounded puppy all in one day, and the people I'm thinking of would be on this very forum/twitter saying. "Pff, why not 2? The moaning bastard". Hell, Alonso got criticised for pointing out a rules violation at Valencia, and then got pissed off when the FIA f**ked up the handling of it. Meanwhile the same people were defending Lewis for lying at Albert Park saying it was all blown out of proportion. THAT is what this thread is about - why we, and the FIA judge drivers differently.

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Has Alonso not always been criticised by the British media or did just it start around Hungary 2008? Genuine question.

People are always going to dislike "their" drivers rival. It was the same in 90´s when Hill was losing to Schumacher, at lot of the British fans (me included at that time) didn´t like Schumacher. Obviously he didn´t help himself by being involved in various incidents, but I imagine the picture was somewhat different in Germany.

Again, I don't think the British media are generally especially against Alonso.

It's some of the fans who have the problem, and yes, the vast majority of them started only in the McLaren battle of 2007.

I think it's actually quite unfair to lump, 'the Lewis crew', in altogether. Do we all automatically share the same opinion? What's been gleaned from this topic is not how the FIA views drivers, which I believe is largely equal, but how we as supporters view both drivers and other supporters. National stereotypes are clearly the height of fashion, to which I would say that as a Lewis supporter I do not write, 'The Sun', and I'm just grateful when F1 gets recognised by mainstream media at all. I'm not any less educated because I support Lewis Hamilton.

I think you've mis-read.

I wasn't suggesting all Lewis fans are less educated, I was referring to the less educated Lewis fans - in particular those who started watching again when Lewis joined McLaren.

I think he was referring to me, as he quoted 'the Lewis crew' which is my wording from my previous post. Whilst it was a generalisation I think it was pretty obvious about the people I was referring to, some on here, some (mostly) on Twitter. I was extremely disappointed to how those people reacted to the Valencia mess, to name just one example. That part has very little to do with the press as it involved hardcore motorsport fans who I had much more respect for before they started blaming everything including world hunger and AIDS on Alonso. It was embarrassing to even like Lewis during that time for me.

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Perhaps - "less educated" was my wording from the previous page.