Prodrive will not enter in 2008

But how can Prodrive be refused entry to the season using a customer car, if clearly STR and SA are using customer cars ? :s

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"Trulli was slowing down like he wanted to have a picnic" LOL

RBR were 'legal' because they let a third party design their car. This third party was the design department of RBR, so it was still designed by RBRs men, but in an other company. Because it was designed by another company STR were able to let their car made by this company too, which was the same car.

They used a loophole in the rules.

Is that RedBull technologies ?

So if Honda make up some dept like that, ie Honda technologies would it then be legal too ?!

Silly.

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"Trulli was slowing down like he wanted to have a picnic" LOL

Yeah, it's silly. Yet not their fault, but one from the FIA not to cover that in the rules.

chet Wrote:
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> Also what do people think about outsides selling
> chassis to teams. Like ermm, lets say Lola
> designed a chassis, would it be ok for them to
> sell it to another team for them to develop it
> them selves ???


Personally, I think this is the route F1 teams searching for ready made chassis should take. It doesn't offend my sense of sporting fair play if a non F1 company designs a chassis for a team and they purchase it along with perhaps some sort of developmental agreement. Dallara or Lola could do this job, possibly Panoz. These companies could surely step up to F1 design after having done IRL and Champcar, though granted, this would be more expensive. But hey, if a shopper knows the price and is willing to pay it so be it.

It just seems somehow "dishonest" for a F1 team to be running someone elses car the way ProDrive would have been. Toro Rosso does have their own aero and engineering departments, and we all saw how Aguri took Hondas cast off and outperformed works machinery by adapting it, but I would rather a team have to go outside to another source and then bring it into F1.

Anyway, just my opinion here.....



"There are some pikeys there at Turn 10 putting tarmac down - what do you think of that?" - Martin Brundle

Dallara or Lola could do this job, possibly Panoz.

Dallara is getting an exclusive IRL Contract and is redoing the current chassis, so I think they'll be a bit busy. They are also involved with a Grand Am Daytona Prototype.

Panoz...not a chance. The Panoz GT cars are ropey at best, but the single seaters are awful. The IRL Panoz is a death trap, and the DP01 is broken in every sense of the word. Even if you gave Panoz a 2 year build up to F1, they would produce a car worthy of equaling the Mastercard Lola.

And on the topic of Lola, why not? The only reason the 97 car was junk was because Mastercard pushed in through a year early. The Lola 00/02B Champ Car chassis was excellent, as were all the ones before it. The LMPs which they build and run are excellent, despite there age, and they do a bunch of lower series Single Seaters too. Lola combined with Prodrive would be an excellent F1 team for 2009.

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Lola have nowhere near enough money to build and design an F1 car - they're still in masses of debt due to the '97 car, and losing the CART contract and the MG Le Mans pull-out a few years ago have really hit them hard. At the moment they're just struggling to survive and an F1 project is completely out of the question

Unless Prodrive comes a long with a bit of cash. Having recently acquired Aston Martin they seem to be doing well, and willing to invest further

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Hmm, Lola owned by Prodrive. Not there'd be a dream team....

lol.
it would be something :D

maybe when f1 is abit cheaper lola could retry... we know they can make good racing cars, and with all the experince/knowlegde the have it would sure be a good car.

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"Trulli was slowing down like he wanted to have a picnic" LOL

Does Prodrive own Aston Martin? I thought it was just a consortium lead by Dave Richards? I have to admit I didn't follow it mind.

Yup, now officially owned by British hands again :D

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"Trulli was slowing down like he wanted to have a picnic" LOL

Does Prodrive own Aston Martin? I thought it was just a consortium lead by Dave Richards? I have to admit I didn't follow it mind.

Yeah, Prodrive own Aston now, and Ford are completely out of it. For the first time that means the Aston Martins in LMS and Le Mans is an official works effort and not a Prodrive effort with some Ford funding.

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Just reading up on it from June, and apparently Richards used his Prodrive connections to lead the take over, but his own money not the company's. Kuwati investors have put up a significant shareholding, and Ford have retained 40%. Has that changed?

It should have changed. First I heard about it was when I was at Le Mans. radio Le Mans had an interview with him where he talked about a complete take over of Aston Marin, and using the brand name on other Prodrive efforts...which at the moment is limited to the Subaru WRC effort, the Le Mans Aston Martin entries, and F1.

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I will say that as above. Prodrive have succeeded at EVERY SINGLE motorsport discipline they've entered. As most of you guys will know, Bennetton and latterly BAR made massive steps foward under its (DR's) control.

So, theres 2 aspects to consider here IMO.

Firstly the choice by Prodrive to run customer cars. Correct me if Im wrong, but Prodrive won the competition in early 06? 18 months is a short time, but they appear to have done very little in terms of building an infrastructure. I personally havent seen any ads in magazines looking to hire staff for a F1 team. Whether thats a Tech Director (may have been Lapworth in the short term) or even "just" sub assembly technicians. Even if they assume the Mac-Prodrives would of come painted completely and ready to run. You have to be able to make changed throughout a season. I cant believe McLaren would of continued to supply aero upgrades through out the season. Its mainly the reason that Super Aguri have continued to punch above the parent company by being better at R&D this year. I wondered idly last year whether this was just a smoke screen. And that come late 07 DR would announce he'd sold the entry to A N Other company.

I guess my point here is just how serious were Prodrive? They could of designed and built a solid 1st year car, and been testing for at least 6 months. Sure, in Season 1 they may of scored a couple of points, but DR had been quoted previously as saying that if a manufacturer came to them with a proposal for a 3 year deal they dont indulge. They ONLY look for multi-year options. To give stability to the workforce and also to see how serious the car maker actually is.

Secondly the McLaren angle. I personally beleive that McLaren have become a bad thing to be associated with this year. Not so much amongst the more rounded F1 fans (such as ourselves) but amongst the Blue Chip companies that Prodrive F1 (PF1) would of liked to get on board. Too much controversy. Spygate. Driver acrimony. Its a long way from the cool calm image Ron likes to pervey to the world. In fact aside from the (sickening) Lewis Mania. McLaren seem to have self destructed this year! Hardly a good backdrop to asking a Chinese bank to give you $200M.

A cynic might argue that Mosely has a vested interest in loosing McLaren a valuable source of income. Especially in light of their fine. Whilst I can see the logic and wouldnt put it past him. Its quite interesting that its SFW thats putting the boot in. And scuppered the deal so convincingly. (Pay back for all the staff Rons poached from Frank and Patrick over the years?)

Overall, not surprised.

Prodrive has plenty of talent people in there team, as well as facilities owned by Aston/Ford to use. They are as prepared for F1 as they should have been at this point.

They did not start designing a car because the FIA told them they didn't have to. None of the teams that applied for the 2008 position were in a position to enter F1 had customer cars not been legal, and thats why the FIA Said they would be. Now they turn round and say they won't be legal, giving them no time to prepare.

Prodrive does not have millions to spend on things they should not have needed. They prepared for the situation of running a customer car, like they were all told they would. Now they have about 17 months to prepare a brand new car for 2009.

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I might kick myself but I (don't) think taht Prodrive is so naive with that 'costumer cars' roole or whatewer it was (supoused to be). I tnink if that roole was posible for '08, I don't remember from other teams (like Agusi, Spyker/FI, Toro Rosso) that consider that option or I miss something. Prodrive (like an serious company) must have their (serious) back-up plan. I only can say taht I realy don't expect them to showe up in Australia '08 because they sounded like dhey do not doing anything (or just watin brand new MP4/23).
If I remember, back in '01 Toyota was more than year testing their car(s) to make it when they anounced they arival in F1 in '02.
We definitly dont know (or know just very little) what Richards and his team (company?) have in mind and what was their thrue plans.
I just can't imagine that they do nothing to showe will for F1, or I just have that feeling.
...and remember just how was Aguri struggle with their (miracle) arival in F1 and Aguri is for me way to smaller company (team) then Prodrive, and just yearafter their arival they enjoy results of their work!

Your posts are bloody difficult to read.

I don't remember from other teams (like Agusi, Spyker/FI, Toro Rosso) that consider that option or I miss something.

Super Aguri and STR would have moved to fully legal customer cars. At the moment they are exploiting a loop-hole.

Super Aguri also entered F1 with Honda backing (something Prodrive would not have gotten) and a pre-built chassis in the form of the Arrows. Contrary to popular belief, Super Aguri were not built from nothing on a budget of nothing, and certainly did not scratch build a car.

STR is an even worse team to compare Prodrive to. STR are Red Bull backed and didn't bother even modifying an old car, they just got given a RBR3 through a loop-hole, slapped a big red bull sticker on the side, got some Red Bull finding, and off they went.

Unlike Super Aguri and STR, Prodrive would be starting from scratch, with no support other than being given a chassis. They would be on there own from that point onward.

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