It just gets worse, suzuka dropped for 07

So long as Suzuka stays where it is and Fuji takes Imola's slot, I don't care what happens with a second Japanese race. Bernie can take as much of Toyota's Yen as he can carry.


Frappe...
Glyko me ghala.

sorry but have u every seen fuji as it is now?
its miles worse then imola !

if it was in place of china i wouldnt mind too much, it better not be in place of suzuka tho


[www.evoracingteam.co.uk]

It's a ok track (i like it in GT4) but i think Suzuka craps all over it.

I don't think the teams and drivers could do more then twenty races in a year IMO i mean the drivers might not care as much but the poor guys cleanign the tyres and cooking to food would be away from their homes to long

The Thunder from Downunder

Fuji used to be a good track - used to before Tilke and the FIA got to it, of course.

But even before that Suzuka was better... problem is it's all about the $$.

Altho as a racing facility Fuji does look stunning, looks like a fantastic place to work... and I guess that's the problem, the old circuits really don't stack up anymore and they're not keeping their places on the calendar through history. It's a shame but anyone who has worked in Silverstone's garages will attest that the place needs to be torn down and rebuilt - it's actually vaguely embarrassing.

fair, and often said point, but at an F1 weekend theres a few hundred staff that have to 'suffer' and a few hundred million that do't give a toss about the facilities.
me being one of them.
i want some decent racing on good historical tracks - i'll let a few boredromes in but only a few.
let the mechanics suffer for the benifit of the rest of us

____
Tony

b-tone Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> let the mechanics suffer for the benifit of the
> rest of us


as a mechanic, that's a really bad attitude for people to take... we have to work in those conditions (even tho atm we're only running regional FFords, that's not the point) - if Silverstone can be embarrassed by Oulton Park then you know something needs to change. Too many of the "big name" circuits are relying on just that... their name & reputation.

Don't get me wrong I love watching racing at Silverstone or Spa, but the places are @#$%& holes tbh. Silverstone's garages flood, the electrics in places don't work, our toilet didn't have a light and the door didn't close, there's big gaps in the walls... I could go on. tbh we're lucky the GP still goes there, and after working there I really do side with Bernie.

But at the end of the day I'm fed up with Tilkedromes - altho that's as much the FIA's fault as anyone's since they think they know what makes good racing, when they quite blatantly don't (Mr Tilke competes in the Ring 24 hours ffs, he knows a good track :p).

i wouldn't mind if suzuka was not technically hard circuit but there are less circuits like that now. suzuka should remain.

crap tracks like france, hungry, germany, china get to stay and we lose suzuka how stupid is that

marcl Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> crap tracks like france, hungry, germany, china
> get to stay and we lose suzuka how stupid is that


It's generally the reason I've outlined - altho it's more for the vips than the lowly mechanics, cos Magny Cours is a dump too

as a mechanic, that's a really bad attitude for people to take... we have to work in those conditions (even tho atm we're only running regional FFords, that's not the point) - if Silverstone can be embarrassed by Oulton Park then you know something needs to change. Too many of the "big name" circuits are relying on just that... their name & reputation.

Don't get me wrong I love watching racing at Silverstone or Spa, but the places are @#$%& holes tbh. Silverstone's garages flood, the electrics in places don't work, our toilet didn't have a light and the door didn't close, there's big gaps in the walls... I could go on. tbh we're lucky the GP still goes there, and after working there I really do side with Bernie.

But at the end of the day I'm fed up with Tilkedromes - altho that's as much the FIA's fault as anyone's since they think they know what makes good racing, when they quite blatantly don't (Mr Tilke competes in the Ring 24 hours ffs, he knows a good track :p).

Too many of the "big name" circuits are relying on just that... their name & reputation.

for many people the name and rep is more than enough. i'm sure monaco isn't much fun to work at, or find accomadation etc but its probably the most popular gp for non f1 fans. because of its name, rep and history.

if the facilites are no good then do them up, but dont replace good tracks with good facilities.
silverstones problems are silverstones. they get a good enough telling off every year, but nothing happens - i know they spend a quilionbillion every year, but from your experience it doesnt sound like much is improving.

tilke's made lots of nice facilites in the last few years - sepang, bahrain, istanbul, hockenhiem plus all the modifications and apart from 'turn 8' the whole lot has been crap.
if i turn on the idiot box and see a boring race at monza or silverstone i can atleast watch the ghosts racing alongside.
nice facilities mean nothing to the tv viewer and add nothing to watching the race on tv - which is what 99% of f1 viewers do.

bernie et al can choose to please a few thousand tv viewers, or please a couple of fat rich guys. and i guess the fat guys have their hands in bernie's pockets so he makes his choices.

i still think F1 is being threatened by dtm, gp2, a1gp, masters etc. f1 is essentially europe only as north america has its own stuff, and most of those series are based in europe so there is direct competition.
the end of last years dtm season was great. as was gp2.
with a bit of variation in tracks (dtm at bh next year?), close racing, big names (prost in dtm nxt year?) f1 is losing ground.
i hope coverage of dtm and gp2 here improves next year as thats about the only thing f1 is better at now.

sorry if i offend any mechanics, but your comfort means nothing to a tv viewer. just like bernie getting pampered by a few dozen sheiks means nothing

____
Tony

b-tone Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> if the facilites are no good then do them up, but
> dont replace good tracks with good facilities.
> silverstones problems are silverstones. they get a
> good enough telling off every year, but nothing
> happens - i know they spend a quilionbillion every
> year, but from your experience it doesnt sound
> like much is improving.
>

Yeah, that's what I mean. Don't get me wrong I'd hate to lose the classic tracks from the F1 calendar but I was just outlining the reasons for it.

bernie et al can choose to please a few thousand tv viewers, or please a couple of fat rich guys. and i guess the fat guys have their hands in bernie's pockets so he makes his choices.

the FIA have more of a hand in it than Bernie imo, but he's not exactly blameless (altho the pressure he puts on Silverstone would be a good thing if they just bloody well listened..) but the point remains - the FIA always seems to do things the wrong way, boring cars on boring tracks isn't what people want to watch, guys!

I think my main point is keep the classics, but make them a pleasure to work/be at without ballsing up the track.. unfortunately this isn't happening and the FIA/Bernie and the teams to an extent are looking elsewhere to entertain their sponsors/investors/fat cats :p

i still think F1 is being threatened by dtm, gp2, a1gp, masters etc. f1 is essentially europe only as north america has its own stuff, and most of those series are based in europe so there is direct competition.
the end of last years dtm season was great. as was gp2.
with a bit of variation in tracks (dtm at bh next year?), close racing, big names (prost in dtm nxt year?) f1 is losing ground.
i hope coverage of dtm and gp2 here improves next year as thats about the only thing f1 is better at now.

spot on, especially for the 'hardcore' fan anyway - these formulae won't overtake (if you pardon the pun) F1 until they get exposure, but without popularity they don't get exposure. Vicious circle unfortunately (by getting exposure I mean being put on live on free-to-air tv, not satellite).

Getting way off topic but in the end F1 had better stop crawling up its own arse otherwise it risks its popularity plummeting. Its already pissed off the hardcore fans enough over the past few years, at some point the final straw will come and people will completely give up on it.. shame.

e// and the comfort thing doesn't overly bother me, I'm sleeping effectively outside at Anglesey at the weekend.. North Wales in December, bloody lovely :D

e2// spelt Anglesey wrong, fool :/




Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 11/29/2005 01:37PM by six degrees.

"f1 is essentially europe only"

bzzzzz

wrong answer

---

I'm sorry btone but F1 is not europe only! South America has been watching F1 since the 70s. The viewers in Asia are also growing, not to mention Japan where they are pretty faithfull to F1.

If you combine the Asian and South American viewers, I could easily say that european viewers are the minority.

Yes europe is the birth place for F1 and a top market, but the greatnes of F1 is that it has grown beyond europe, it's part of the world now.

It is ridiculous they wish to replace the track that has provided some of the top racing in the past years (including this season's best race!)...

sorry for upsetting our s.american and asian readers
f1 is of course big in s america and growing in asia. asia is a prety new market and i don't really feel its that big, or deep as in europe or south america.
and i have no idea how it is in south america.
but gp2, a1gp, and masters all have prety strong south american participation, so if people there do get bored of f1 they are a threat.

spot on, especially for the 'hardcore' fan anyway - these formulae won't overtake (if you pardon the pun) F1 until they get exposure, but without popularity they don't get exposure. Vicious circle unfortunately (by getting exposure I mean being put on live on free-to-air tv, not satellite).

Getting way off topic but in the end F1 had better stop crawling up its own arse otherwise it risks its popularity plummeting. Its already pissed off the hardcore fans enough over the past few years, at some point the final straw will come and people will completely give up on it.. shame.

they are getting exposre to a certain extent.
gp2 was on tv here last year, and that was its first seaso - a success by most measures, so next year everyone will want it. and as its junior f1 it will be in a similar place distribution wise.
dtm has huge crowds at the races, and was in turkey, czech rep and holland this year - italy, britain, portugal not long ago (and maybe in the future). and if a few more big names (prost, zanardi?, fisichella...) go there tv stations will want it.
a1gp and masters are more unknown but tv stations will be ready to show it in case it is popular. if a1gp can get a few f1 drivers in there it would be interesting to watch.

as for hard core fans - they have no money. but the guys who want a place in the world - but dont know anything about f1 - have bucketfuls

____
Tony

you should have said that you have no idea about the market distribution straight away

---