The 'Who goes where for 2013?' Thread

Posted by Incident 2k9 
The 'Who goes where for 2013?' Thread
Date: June 05, 2012 04:00PM
Posted by: Incident 2k9
It's getting to that time; although rumours flying around F1 are part and parcel of the sport, now the talking point is ahead to next season.

And the most common question (other than 'Has Bernie gone crazy?';) is 'Who's going where?'. Let's have a look at the possibilities.

Red Bull:

Vettel is almost a certainty to stay. He's been a cornerstone to Red Bull's title challenges and brings much publicity to the team as he's one of their home-grown stars. The second seat has already kicked up a bit of a storm. Webber has been linked with Ferrari, and being good friends with Alonso would definitely help him in that respect. But none of the other Red Bull-backed potential drivers are quite ready for the responsibility that the Number 2 seat has. Buemi lacks race practise and rarely shows flashes of brilliance. Alguersuari is a very determined racer, but not on great terms with the mug that is Helmut Marko. Ricciardo has floundered a bit in the races despite being quite handy in qualifying, and Vergne is the exact opposite. Should Webber leave, they'd probably have to cast their net elsewhere. Hamilton has been linked with the seat too, but looks poised to sign a mega-bucks contract with McLaren.

I would imagine, though, that Webber would stay. He's probably got one or two seasons left and although there'd be the temptation of driving for the Prancing Horse, Red Bull have the equipment to provide him with that last hurrah.

McLaren:

Hamilton most probably would stay with the team that brought him from karts to the F1 WDC. He'd obviously get a huge boost to his bank balance if he did, so that's another bonus for him. Button would most likely stay too, seeing as he already has a contract with the team for 2013. Neither of the test drivers, Gary Paffett and Oliver Turvey, ever look like stepping up and nobody really knows who McLaren would actually go for as a replacement. Both drivers to stay, I feel.

Ferrari:

Now here's where it gets interesting. Alonso's contracted until 2016, so he's a given. The second seat has been the focus of much speculation, fuelled by Massa's underacheivement in the last couple of seasons. Perez has been very much linked to the seat but Montezemolo has ruled him out, for 2013 anyway. Webber's been linked too; he'd surely love the opportunity for a swansong in the (cliché alert) most evocative marque in F1. So who, if anyone, would replace Massa?

I would not imagine it would be Jules Bianchi, as he's shown in GP2 that he's a bit crash-happy. Plus, he's inexperienced and probably wouldn't be good enough to drive for them anyway. Glock or Kovalainen could be viable options, as both have persevered with their (relatively) new outfits and deserve a go at the top. Kobayashi could be an option too, as he's a real racer and would push Alonso. However, despite the protestations I think they'd be mad not to sign up Perez.

Mercedes:

Rosberg has now found some form this season, and has picked up 59 points in the last 4 races. He's also contracted for 2013, so should stay. Speculation surrounds Schumacher though, regarding his retirement in particular. So far, he's not found this season to his taste and has let that be known. However, this is possibly a cover for his own misgivings and should probably call it a day now in my eyes (I know that certain members will disagree). He's not seemingly able to unlock the potential of the car and perhaps should hand over to someone who is very much part of this age of F1.

And we more or less know who this is: Paul di Resta. He's been groomed (not in THAT way) by Merc for a while now, and should be odds on to step in there should The Formerly-Red-Now-Silver Baron retire.

Lotus:

They'd be mad to can either driver. Both have been very good so far this year (other than when Grosjean ends up facing the wrong way at the opening stages), so they should keep them both.

Force India:

As mentioned, if Schumacher retires then Di Resta is probably off. Hulkenberg looks to be getting back in the swing of things, so would be a good bet to lead the team next season. Now, despite the fact Bianchi 'tests' for the team, don't take for granted that he'll follow in the current drivers' footsteps and get a race-seat. Mallya wouldn't want to spend money on new cars, because as mentioned earlier Bianchi is a little 'wild' in his driving. I think the best bet here is Alguersuari. Pirelli testing should keep him relatively fresh, and he's a very good racer. Don't rule out Merc DTM-protogés Robert Wickens and Christian Vietoris for test seats, though.

Sauber:

If Perez ends up at Ferrari, in order to keep the Telmex money should elevate Gutierrez. Gutierrez hasn't been amazing in GP2, but could definitely do a good job for Sauber. Massa is another alternative if he leaves Ferrari. Kobayashi would most likely stay, as chances are he'd continue to be overlooked for the top seats.

Toro Rosso:

Would probably stay the same. The drivers need more experience.

Williams:

Drivers bring lots of money. Williams need money, ergo status quo. Bottas is a possibility, though.

Caterham:

Probably the same, I'd imagine. Drivers push one another and the car's slowly improving.

Marussia:

Glock would most likely see out the remainder of his contract. Would Pic stay? Probably, but John Booth might dip into GP2 again for another driver.

HRT:

De La Rosa, and anyone who pays. Could be Karthikeyan again, or might be another Red Bull backed driver. Who knows?

GP2's dearth of talent:

Davide Valsecchi is currently winning, with Luiz Razia second and van der Garde 3rd. These drivers have been in GP2 for a while, and although that partially allowed Maldonado and Petrov to get seats, maybe they're not brilliant bets for F1 seats. Having said that, they could do a solid job. James Calado's been pretty good, and he could be a good bet for a reserve seat somewhere. Max Chilton's been consistent, too. From the first-year drivers (other than Calado), Nasr should be doing better at DAMS, Dillmann's been quite unlucky and Berthon's ok but not spectacular. One thing's agreed, Giancarlo Serenelli is the most useless driver ever.

For me, it's the following:

Red Bull: Vettel, Webber
McLaren: Button, Hamilton
Ferrari: Alonso, Perez
Merc: Rosberg, Di Resta
Lotus: Raikkonen, Grosjean
FI: Hulkenberg, Alguersuari
Sauber: Kobayashi, Gutierrez
Toro Rosso: Ricciardo, Vergne
Williams: Maldonado, Senna
Caterham: Kovalainen, Petrov
Marussia: Glock, Pic
HRT: De la Rosa, whoever's got money.

What are your predictions?



GPGSL: S6 - TafuroGP Tester (14th) /// S7 - ART Tester (6th) /// S8 - Demon Driver (13th) /// S9 - Demon/Snake Driver (13th) /// S10 - Snake Driver (???) ///]
"My ambition is handicapped by laziness" - Charles Bukowski



Edited 4 time(s). Last edit at 06/06/2012 11:16AM by Incident 2k9.
Thanks for the heads up.... Wrong place though lol
Re: The 'Who goes where for 2013?' Thread
Date: June 06, 2012 11:05AM
Posted by: gav
Clearly everyone and their mothers are linking Webber with Ferrari, though as you say, it would be ideal for Red Bull if he was to have one final season before they brought in one of their own.

Still, not getting on with Marko, flagging in the race after a decent qualifying... isn't that ideal for a 2nd RBR driver? ;)



I guess Hamilton will stay at McLaren, but a lot may depend on how well they recover over the next couple of months. He's certainly calmer this season, but I'd guess if the cock-ups continue to happen, he's bound to start doubting whether he can win a championship with them over the next few seasons. A quiet word from Ron about how much they've done for him ought to be enough for him to quell any doubts that may start lingering.


Massa's gone. Barring an unheard of recovery, they've got to get shot of him. It's a sign of how poor he's been that Monaco was seen as a good result for him - he still finished 6th to Alonso's podium after starting alongside him. It's a credit to Ferrari that he's still there after the torrid start he's had - maybe the Latin temperament is dimming somewhat.


Alongside the 2nd Ferrari seat, Schumacher will be the key. When he signed for Merc, I didn't see him completing the 2 year contract, never mind the additional 1 season option. Will he come back for a 4th? I'm thinking no, but again, it might depend on how well they finish the season - if they're still genuinely challenging for race wins, I think he'll be tempted. Still, I can see di Resta partnering Rosberg.


We said before the season that it's going to be hard to judge Lotus. Is the car flattering the drivers? Is Kimi as strong after his return and is Grosjean worse than the car is showing? For all we know, the car could be the best on the grid and they'd be leading both championships if a Button or Webber was in the car - I can guarantee it would certainly be winning if Alonso was in the car. I don't feel Kimi is there yet, and consequently Grosjean too isn't performing yet either (I don't mind his adventures - he's still relatively inexperienced), but the only way to know how well the drivers are performing is to study the data, so I guess only the team will know. But even if they feel the drivers aren't performing, I can't seeing them affording any substantially better drivers... though I can see Webber being a good fit there if he fancies a number 1 or equal number 1 status in a strong car.


Sauber and Williams are clearly good cars this year. Kobayashi hasn't lived up to the hype he created in the final races of 2009 and 2010, so despite me desperately wanting the entertainment at the front of the grid, there's no way a top team will be hiring him. Clearly Perez is highly thought of, so he could well be off to Ferrari (though, as mentioned and somewhat surprisingly, everything is pointing towards Webber going there at the moment).

Williams desperately need some funds to get a top driver. They've got a car capable of consistent points finishes, and with a decent driver, they'd clock up those points. Senna has been @#$%&, far worse than I expected, and Maldonado continues to drive with his GP2 head on of being excellent or crashing. I'd love to see how much a decent, consistent, experienced driver would bring to the team... such as Rubens. As it is, they'll continue with Maldonada and probably Bottas if Senna's contract is just for the single year.


Force India are disappointing me a little. I know they don't have the money to move forward, but after getting consistently better over the past few seasons, and the apparently strong pre-season form they were showing, I expected them to be a little further forward. di Resta is getting better after a poor start, and Hulkenberg isn't doing what we'd thought. Still, neither driver is doing enough to be replaced, so, providing di Resta doesn't get a call up to replace Schumacher, it'll be status quo.


STR: as said, the drivers need more experience.


Cateram need to be making the car faster now - the drivers are as good as they can attract. I'm getting bored of them proclaiming they'll be better next season. As normal, they're mixing it in the race now, which is promising, but it's about now in the season that they stop being able to develop the car and fall away again.


I'd love to see Glock in a better car again (perhaps Williams?), as I feel he's going through the motions now. I admire decent drivers wanting to drive for smaller teams and trying to move them forward... but he's not going to. They'll be around the back of the grid, a second or 2 from the established teams until someone invests in them or they call it quits.


For HRT, see above. That and the fact that I wish Karthikeyan retires on the warm up lap of every race, because he inevitably @#$%& it up for the rest of them by refusing to let them lap him until they get to the apex of a corner. It's not often I'm this harsh, but Narain, you're still @#$%&, and now you're an even bigger tit than you were before too. Piss off.
Re: The 'Who goes where for 2013?' Thread
Date: June 06, 2012 04:09PM
Posted by: kubica2
hamilton would be dumb to blame mclarens cock-ups for his chances and head to another team. he has literally cost mclaren championships in the past with his errors in 2007 and 2011 and nearly in 2008 and not playing the team game in 2007. the team has made some errors in pitstops, but it is a teamsport, and how many times has hamilton acted like he is more important then the team with his scathing comments over the radio to the team over the years whenever they make a mistake. mclaren put him in f1, and with the results he got in his rookie year, you would have to say his next seasons have been dissapointing, he hasnt really got better as a race driver, sure he is always fast in qualifying, but he is only about 4th in the field on race pace, his tyre management and race errors hurting him badly over the passed few years.

i dont see redbull or ferrari wanting him, unless he takes a number 2 position to vettel or alonso. maybe he would go to mercedes, but then he would have to deal with rosberg who is a top driver, and he is having enough trouble with button, who many dont consider a top class driver.
Re: The 'Who goes where for 2013?' Thread
Date: June 06, 2012 04:53PM
Posted by: mitadumapaga
yep. true that. hamilton had a great shot at the title in 2010 (not so 2011), 2008, 2007. But you have to admit he had slow cars in 2011 and 2009. So, maybe it is time for a change. i dont think he is that motivated any more in mclaren
Re: The 'Who goes where for 2013?' Thread
Date: June 06, 2012 05:07PM
Posted by: Incident 2k9
Quote
kubica2
hamilton would be dumb to blame mclarens cock-ups for his chances and head to another team. he has literally cost mclaren championships in the past with his errors in 2007 and 2011 and nearly in 2008 and not playing the team game in 2007. the team has made some errors in pitstops, but it is a teamsport, and how many times has hamilton acted like he is more important then the team with his scathing comments over the radio to the team over the years whenever they make a mistake. mclaren put him in f1, and with the results he got in his rookie year, you would have to say his next seasons have been dissapointing, he hasnt really got better as a race driver, sure he is always fast in qualifying, but he is only about 4th in the field on race pace, his tyre management and race errors hurting him badly over the passed few years.

i dont see redbull or ferrari wanting him, unless he takes a number 2 position to vettel or alonso. maybe he would go to mercedes, but then he would have to deal with rosberg who is a top driver, and he is having enough trouble with button, who many dont consider a top class driver.

I do agree with most of this; I think the main problem is that he never had a season at a 'lesser' team to get some grounding in. If, for example, he'd been farmed out to Spyker he might be a little more appreciative of the effort the team have put in to develop the car. However, it must be said that during the latter half of 2009, he stopped moaning and actually managed to get McLaren into 3rd in the WCC.

But he had the best car on the grid in his first 2 seasons, and it would be criminal to do anything less than he did in 2008 (especially as most of the focus was on him in '08).

Quote
mitadumapaga
yep. true that. hamilton had a great shot at the title in 2010 (not so 2011), 2008, 2007. But you have to admit he had slow cars in 2011 and 2009. So, maybe it is time for a change. i dont think he is that motivated any more in mclaren

They say familiarity breeds contempt. As Button's come in and actually turned out to be a bit more media-friendly, he's perhaps brightened up the corporate, stoic image of McLaren and is at equal footing within the team. Hamilton is a little bit of a corporate drone, and maybe a spell at Red Bull would sort him out in this respect and put a spring in his step...

I would like to say that, despite not being a fan of Lewis', he's a very quick driver and the way he adapted to F1 was outstanding. But he needs to perhaps think about seeing if he can engineer a move to Red Bull, lest he become another Jacques Villeneuve (who was too loyal to BAR and we know how this ended...)



GPGSL: S6 - TafuroGP Tester (14th) /// S7 - ART Tester (6th) /// S8 - Demon Driver (13th) /// S9 - Demon/Snake Driver (13th) /// S10 - Snake Driver (???) ///]
"My ambition is handicapped by laziness" - Charles Bukowski



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/06/2012 05:08PM by Incident 2k9.
Re: The 'Who goes where for 2013?' Thread
Date: June 06, 2012 05:26PM
Posted by: J i m
I think largely the status quo is going to be maintained. Partly because of some rather large personalities being well established at the grandee teams and partly because the technical regs will be relatively static until we get to 2014. Then it might make more sense for a few fresh starts as it were.

Red Bull:
Vettel is almost certain to stay as he has well and truly fingerd down his red carpet, and what logic is there to abandon a Renault propelled Adrian Newey designed car? He'll stay as long as the dream team remains intact. I think Webber will stay too, he's driving well, Horner wants him to stay and he's been a cornerstone of the Milton Keynes squad pretty much throughout his career. I think he'll be flatterd by supposed Ferrari interest but again he'll trust Newey more to give him the car he needs. None of the Red Bull junior lot are ready to step up, Alguersauri may have been but bridges have been burnt.

McLaren:
Button is under contract, and despite his current woes with the tyres the team has very much gelled around him, he likes it there, he knows that McLaren are one of the very few teams you can reley upon to almost always build a car capable of winning and hence he'll stay probably until retirement. Slight question mark over Hamilton and I hope his management advise him well because his best bet is to stay, not for loyalty but to have a car that at the very least gives him a fighting chance. Ferrari is a no, Alonso would never sanction it, Red Bull perhapps but what if he gets royally shown up by Vettel, what then? Because it kind of doesn't count when he gets shown up by Button since you know ultimately he's still faster. But Vettel would be a different animal to tame altogether, how would Hamilton cope with having to give up a front wing to Vettel? Nope Mclaren is Hamilton's best hope.

Ferrari:
Now Scuderia Alonso, the relentlessly epic Spaniard has well & truly moulded the pracing horse's stable around himself. The question is will Ferrari give Massa the chop? Logic says hell yes! Yet Ferrari have always been more comfortable being a one car team. Luca says that Perez is too inexperienced.. well so is any other driver currently supported by Ferrari then. So who on earth else is worth giving Massa the chop for of not Perez? I have two names to throw into the ring, Alguersauri might just scrape through on experience, plus he'll have a database of Pirelli info in his head for 2013, worth a punt surely? But also... And don't laugh, but Luca never did get over Schumacher returning to F1 with Merc, the 7 time champ is out of contract right? Luca might just try to entice him back to give Perez the time he needs to mature.

Mercedes:
Rosberg is getting along there nicely, I sense he likes being part of the German national team (even if most of the engineering is British based) and the only possible upgrade for him would be McLaren (Hamilton's seat). No, he'll stay in the hope that Brawn puts some consistency into the team. Schumacher, will he stay, go to Ferrari or retire again? Despite his bad season so far he's actually been driving really quite well most weekends.. I sense he'll stay for a 4th year, Afterall Brawn-Schumacher has always been the dream team.

Lotus:
Kimi will stay just so long as a win or two comes his way to keep his interest. Otherwise he might get bored and go off snow mobiling in the name of James Hunt or something. Boullier clearly loves Grosjean but if he continues to swap too much bodywork he might choose to promote Ambrosia Custard.

Force India:
Status quo just so long as Di Resta has to wait another year for Merc promotion.

Sauber:
Status quo, Mexican dollars and Ferrari engines will keep Perez's seat safe.

Williams:
PDVSA pay far too much money, so Maldonaldo will be staying. I just hope he matures a little bit more. He has "some" talent, just needs to drop the stupidity. Senna might need to find yet more sponsors but he really needs to sort out qualifying, his races haven't been "too" bad. But if Bottas continues to impress then Williams will want to try a hopefully ever improving car with a better talent prospect.

STR:
status quo for as long as Marko's patience holds out.

Caterham:
Kovalainen to stay, a collection bowl to be sent around Russia for Petrov.

Marussia:
Glock to stay as nowt else for him, Booth to put second seat on eBay.

HRT:
Drivers? Pffft? Are we sure they'll have a car?

Re: The 'Who goes where for 2013?' Thread
Date: June 06, 2012 06:02PM
Posted by: chet
RedBull

Obviously Vettel, why would he move? It is his team now. Closest thing we have seen a Schumacher-Ferrari dream team. If you're going to fight for championships then you will need a Vettel, Newey, Horner, and what has become the best pit crew. Right now only Alonso is the one thing that could better this combo IMO.

I love Webber, he's a great driver and a great person. I think a lot will depend how the middle part of 2012 goes. If it's okay and he remains in touch with Vettel then why move? RBR will produce a good car in 2013, that's almost a fact. If he can keep up with Vettel, then who knows? Mistakes from Vettel, or a series of bad luck or even an epic streak from Webber will put him into title contention. However I believe either 2012 or 2013 will be his last. On that basis I want him to go to Ferrari.

Mclaren

I want Lewis to move because I think it's boring when drivers stay in teams for so long. At Mclaren he is equal #1 despite clearly being quicker (albeit sometimes crash happy). I place him at Mercedes for 2013 and for either Nico, Kimi or di Resta to fill his shoes.

Button will stay and it could be his last IMO. I am hoping 2012 turns around because after 2011 I believed he had another title in him. Now I am not so sure. Still he is one of the most reliable drivers on the grid, and certainly best race drivers with some of the best race craft of the last 8 or so years IMO.

Ferrari

Alonso, match made in heaven. We all said it, and it's just clicked.

I hopes for Webber.

Mercedes

As said above, hoping for Lewis alongside Nico or di Resta. If it were Nico you have to say Lewis will be equal #1 again, yet if it were di Resta Lewis would probably demand #1. Either way, Nico or Paul, will be great to see!

Lotus

An interesting one... Surely Grosjean will stay but Kimi is the interesting one. I personally would LOVE to see him at Mclaren again. If he can't do that then he will most likely stay, however if there is an open seat then my tip for it is Heikki. He knows the team and has impressed at Caterham and is destroying Petrov, their former driver.

Williams

Pastor and Bottas. Senna will be lucky to be in F1 next year IMO. He needs to improve qualifying and consistency.. big time.

Force India

The hulk alongside Bianchi.. or if di Resta stays then same as 2012

Sauber

KK and Perez. Perez on a 1 year deal to then move to Ferrari in 2014 IMO.

STR

Same as 2012. Would be silly to change. Both seem fairly evenly matched, surely a measure that they are gettign the maximum out of the car?

Caterham

I suppose it would be Petrov and Heikk if he doesnt move. Other than that it's hard to say. If Bianchi does not have a seat, maybe him, or even Senna. IMO they should risk a rookie.

Marussia

Probably the same as 2012, but a lot will depend on whether Glock get's a better offer.

HRT.

Whoever brings the most money. Maybe we should start a GPG fund?






"Trulli was slowing down like he wanted to have a picnic" LOL



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/06/2012 06:02PM by chet.
Re: The 'Who goes where for 2013?' Thread
Date: June 20, 2012 08:24PM
Posted by: truecrysis
I realise this is in advance, but it could affect all your predictions for 2013's lineup. Sources in Ferrari saying Vettel has a pre-contract with Ferrari for 2014, as long as they are atleast 3rd in the championship at the time. Red Bull saying the have Vettel contracted til the end of 2014.

[www.bbc.co.uk]

_________________________________________________

For a list of EVERY download for GP4, look here: [docs.google.com]



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/20/2012 08:25PM by truecrysis.
Re: The 'Who goes where for 2013?' Thread
Date: June 21, 2012 07:53AM
Posted by: gav
I guess the BBC's sources weren't taken too seriously, as I've just read it, and it was reported a month ago. Surely if other outlets felt that was the case, then it would have been more widely reported, and this morning was the first I'd heard of it!
Re: The 'Who goes where for 2013?' Thread
Date: June 21, 2012 07:27PM
Posted by: chet
The more 2012 goes on the more I am enjoying seeing the 3 best, Lewis, Alonso and Vettel in the 3 best cars.

Look at Canada pre tyres going to mush.

Lewis (Mclaren) v's Alonso (Ferrari) v's Vettel (RBR).

It reads so much nicer than having two of them in the same car. Again, look at the championship standings. As much as people would love to see such driver pairings, IMO it could be detrimental to the sports viewing.

Alonso and Lewis was only good because it was an unstable pairing. The only people who liked it before Mclaren/Ron/Alonso/Lewis went nuts were die hard Mclaren, and generic British fans who go wave a flag at silverstone but couldn't tell you who was driving the marussia...?






"Trulli was slowing down like he wanted to have a picnic" LOL
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