rFactor 2 Early Screenshots
Posted by DaveEllis
| Registered: 20 years ago |
| Registered: 19 years ago |
Do you mean you contest the points? If you second them, you agree with them, then I'm confused :P
I second many points, just what consequences do you see?
Consequences for who?
If rFactor is a failed experiment, is Modding as such failing and without future?
rFactor is a failed experiment. Not ISIs fault, but it is. Letting the community do things has proven not to work. Modding is not failed. Modding exists for every game. Relying on modding however has failed.
What does rFactor2 have to do different to not be another failure?
AI that works. Netcode which is up to scratch. FFB that is up to scratch and a lobby system which works. A game that is interesting before user content. That is my short list. To expand upon these.
If you're going to have AI, it needs to work. People say online is the future and that's what everyone wants etc, and I can see that. But if you include AI, make it work. The rFactor AI is a complete mess. Even if you can somehow bodge it around the track, it doesn't race wheel to wheel properly, and it has the slow down/catch up features that only arcade racers have.
The netcode was a bit iffy when it was released, now it's way way out of date. the way cars contact, and just the way they move about the screen looks quite bad now. But that's partly from age, so hopefully rF2 comes with significant improvements.
The Lobby system is also very broken. Some servers don't appear for some drivers, hosting doesn't always work, etc. It's just plain bad.
Most importantly, the game has to have proper content. I don't want rFactor 2 to come out and all we're left with is running around Lime Rock in Renault Meganes for 6 months again. That isn't interesting. Whilst rF2s content appears to be a significant improvement over rF it looks very thinly spread whilst covering a large area. How many historic tracks do we have for that historic single seater? If it's only 1 or 2 then it won't really hold my interest very long.
rFactor to me, is currently useless. Almost everybody I know has moved on. Either to iRacing, to Simbin games, some even to LFS and back to GPL. It takes too much work to get stuff working, and then it relies on the community being awesome. If rF2 has good stock content, I'll buy it. Probably on release day. If it relies on user content to make up the short falls, I won't buy it. It was a nice idea, but it didn't work.
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I second many points, just what consequences do you see?
Consequences for who?
If rFactor is a failed experiment, is Modding as such failing and without future?
rFactor is a failed experiment. Not ISIs fault, but it is. Letting the community do things has proven not to work. Modding is not failed. Modding exists for every game. Relying on modding however has failed.
What does rFactor2 have to do different to not be another failure?
AI that works. Netcode which is up to scratch. FFB that is up to scratch and a lobby system which works. A game that is interesting before user content. That is my short list. To expand upon these.
If you're going to have AI, it needs to work. People say online is the future and that's what everyone wants etc, and I can see that. But if you include AI, make it work. The rFactor AI is a complete mess. Even if you can somehow bodge it around the track, it doesn't race wheel to wheel properly, and it has the slow down/catch up features that only arcade racers have.
The netcode was a bit iffy when it was released, now it's way way out of date. the way cars contact, and just the way they move about the screen looks quite bad now. But that's partly from age, so hopefully rF2 comes with significant improvements.
The Lobby system is also very broken. Some servers don't appear for some drivers, hosting doesn't always work, etc. It's just plain bad.
Most importantly, the game has to have proper content. I don't want rFactor 2 to come out and all we're left with is running around Lime Rock in Renault Meganes for 6 months again. That isn't interesting. Whilst rF2s content appears to be a significant improvement over rF it looks very thinly spread whilst covering a large area. How many historic tracks do we have for that historic single seater? If it's only 1 or 2 then it won't really hold my interest very long.
rFactor to me, is currently useless. Almost everybody I know has moved on. Either to iRacing, to Simbin games, some even to LFS and back to GPL. It takes too much work to get stuff working, and then it relies on the community being awesome. If rF2 has good stock content, I'll buy it. Probably on release day. If it relies on user content to make up the short falls, I won't buy it. It was a nice idea, but it didn't work.
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| Registered: 20 years ago |
Better netcode... not really sure I got many failings on that. The netcode served me better than all other sims I played online.
Better lobby... No discussion. Just 100% agreed!
Better AI... That is a must. rFactor AI is functional, but once you go beyond basic skills, it is not adequate. For that reason, I switched to GTL and GTR2 for offline racing. To my disappointment, the only real advantage of the simbin AI is that it is quicker. Apart from that it has all the drawbacks of the rFactor AI it is based on, and is inadequate for anything else but the shortest races. Which is probably why all the stock simbin races are set to 5 laps or less.
Better community... that is THE major flaw with rFactor IMHO. The reason I dumped rFactor as a sim was because the people I raced with behaved as you would expect in a pick-up counter-strike game, and I can understand the modding scene is just as rife with strife as it is in GPx. Come to think of it pick-up GPL wasn't any better. I think we all remember the Lotus drivers that would talk big in every practice session and then they would cause huge T1 pileups, reset, crash into someone else, reset, repeat until they disconnected. Then it would start all over again the next race.
The competition races at RacerAlex were awesome, but they also had race stewards available at every event. This is symptomatic for the internet. I recently joined some online FPS gaming via steam, only to discover, that they vote-kick newbs on principle. I am a 25+ years of experience computer gamer, and veteran ex-clan FPS player... and even I was vote kicked while learning the ropes, despite having locked down the basics while completing the single player game. Random encounters on the internet have a tendency to bring out the worst in people. All the places that retain any sustained, and not just periodical, functionality are moderated, and participants are held in line by fear - they do not want to be ejected either by force or their peers.
Sad but true, most people just suck. I can't blame ISI for that. What I want is some tools that can help me sort and take out the trash.
It's only after we've lost everything, that we are free to do anything.
Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 08/23/2010 01:25PM by Morbid.
Better lobby... No discussion. Just 100% agreed!
Better AI... That is a must. rFactor AI is functional, but once you go beyond basic skills, it is not adequate. For that reason, I switched to GTL and GTR2 for offline racing. To my disappointment, the only real advantage of the simbin AI is that it is quicker. Apart from that it has all the drawbacks of the rFactor AI it is based on, and is inadequate for anything else but the shortest races. Which is probably why all the stock simbin races are set to 5 laps or less.
Better community... that is THE major flaw with rFactor IMHO. The reason I dumped rFactor as a sim was because the people I raced with behaved as you would expect in a pick-up counter-strike game, and I can understand the modding scene is just as rife with strife as it is in GPx. Come to think of it pick-up GPL wasn't any better. I think we all remember the Lotus drivers that would talk big in every practice session and then they would cause huge T1 pileups, reset, crash into someone else, reset, repeat until they disconnected. Then it would start all over again the next race.
The competition races at RacerAlex were awesome, but they also had race stewards available at every event. This is symptomatic for the internet. I recently joined some online FPS gaming via steam, only to discover, that they vote-kick newbs on principle. I am a 25+ years of experience computer gamer, and veteran ex-clan FPS player... and even I was vote kicked while learning the ropes, despite having locked down the basics while completing the single player game. Random encounters on the internet have a tendency to bring out the worst in people. All the places that retain any sustained, and not just periodical, functionality are moderated, and participants are held in line by fear - they do not want to be ejected either by force or their peers.
Sad but true, most people just suck. I can't blame ISI for that. What I want is some tools that can help me sort and take out the trash.
It's only after we've lost everything, that we are free to do anything.
Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 08/23/2010 01:25PM by Morbid.
| Registered: 19 years ago |
Better netcode... not really sure I got many failings on that. The netcode served me better than all other sims I played online.
It was good at the time, but it's now miles behind. I don't want to pimp iRacing, because this is an rFactor 2 thread, and both games have different philosophies, but looking back it's quite amazing how much net code has progressed. But rFactors was good when it came out, and ISI have shown they can do good net code, so I expect rFactor 2 will improve it further. Stuff like car collisions and having a natural movement for example.
Sad but true, most people just suck. I can't blame ISI for that. What I want is some tools that can help me sort and take out the trash.
Agreed. ISI gave the community the chance, and they failed at it. ISI need to look at that and take control of some aspects which the community has proven they are unable or unwilling to do. Sounds a bit harsh on ISI I suppose, but if they want my purchase for rF2, it has to be worth it.
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It was good at the time, but it's now miles behind. I don't want to pimp iRacing, because this is an rFactor 2 thread, and both games have different philosophies, but looking back it's quite amazing how much net code has progressed. But rFactors was good when it came out, and ISI have shown they can do good net code, so I expect rFactor 2 will improve it further. Stuff like car collisions and having a natural movement for example.
Sad but true, most people just suck. I can't blame ISI for that. What I want is some tools that can help me sort and take out the trash.
Agreed. ISI gave the community the chance, and they failed at it. ISI need to look at that and take control of some aspects which the community has proven they are unable or unwilling to do. Sounds a bit harsh on ISI I suppose, but if they want my purchase for rF2, it has to be worth it.
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theRacingLine.net
SportsCarArchives.com
| Registered: 20 years ago |
I agreed on your statement, that rFactor is a failed experiment. I agree on many of the issues you mentioned and although I'd like to say it differently, I also have to say, that the community always was a bit messy and seperatistic and by now it's barely existant. Leagues continue, but outside of those closed societies, there is little activity. rFactor gave everyone the possibility to create their own game and in this regard it was very democratic, but the result was a loss of unity at the expense of quality.
Do you think the community would have required more moderation? Would this necessarly come from ISI or could the community in itself organize systems or criteria to support quality?
Does modding have to become more elite?
I ask many questions, because those are many thoughts that bug me for the past year and I value input.
Website | Blog | Twitter | CTDP: Site Blog Twitter
Do you think the community would have required more moderation? Would this necessarly come from ISI or could the community in itself organize systems or criteria to support quality?
Does modding have to become more elite?
I ask many questions, because those are many thoughts that bug me for the past year and I value input.
Website | Blog | Twitter | CTDP: Site Blog Twitter
| Registered: 19 years ago |
Do you think the community would have required more moderation? Would this necessarly come from ISI or could the community in itself organize systems or criteria to support quality?
The problem with ISI getting involved in modding is it involves a lot of copyrights and licenses. ISI need to keep themselves clean of that. Does it require more moderation? Yes. Who should do it? No idea. rFactorCentral was a good start and it was slowly improving, and now it's under developed and being milked by SRW. That would be a great place to start again.
Does modding have to become more elite?
It should never exclude new comers and learners. Whilst it should be higher quality, the main issue the community has is it just spends the entire time arguing, and even most of the good mod teams are corrupt. Enduracers are just using Porsche models from NFS. When you post the wireframe them delete it. Niels provided them with a much better tyre model for the LMP mod, and got told to "@#$%& off idiot" because Julien who made the original was offended.
This is how the rFactor community was, and is how I see it being for rFactor 2 as well.
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The problem with ISI getting involved in modding is it involves a lot of copyrights and licenses. ISI need to keep themselves clean of that. Does it require more moderation? Yes. Who should do it? No idea. rFactorCentral was a good start and it was slowly improving, and now it's under developed and being milked by SRW. That would be a great place to start again.
Does modding have to become more elite?
It should never exclude new comers and learners. Whilst it should be higher quality, the main issue the community has is it just spends the entire time arguing, and even most of the good mod teams are corrupt. Enduracers are just using Porsche models from NFS. When you post the wireframe them delete it. Niels provided them with a much better tyre model for the LMP mod, and got told to "@#$%& off idiot" because Julien who made the original was offended.
This is how the rFactor community was, and is how I see it being for rFactor 2 as well.
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theRacingLine.net
SportsCarArchives.com
| Registered: 19 years ago |
Speaking with Nick on MSN. ISI should just make SCGT2 :P and hire better artists :P Imagine the fun! :D
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| Registered: 20 years ago |
| Registered: 20 years ago |
| Registered: 15 years ago |
| Registered: 20 years ago |
Morbid Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Funny how critical and suspicious you are Gui.
> That is so unlike you. Are we regretting all the
> hype we swallowed and regurgitated in the Codies
> thread?
Taking more into consideration. The graphics look a bit washed out and just a slight improvement over rF, it doesn't seem like it can compete with other latest racing titles. It does have some good details and I like the bumpiness, but I'm very careful regarding rFactor 2 after the disappointment of rFactor 1, in my view.
-------------------------------------------------------
> Funny how critical and suspicious you are Gui.
> That is so unlike you. Are we regretting all the
> hype we swallowed and regurgitated in the Codies
> thread?
Taking more into consideration. The graphics look a bit washed out and just a slight improvement over rF, it doesn't seem like it can compete with other latest racing titles. It does have some good details and I like the bumpiness, but I'm very careful regarding rFactor 2 after the disappointment of rFactor 1, in my view.
| Registered: 20 years ago |
| Registered: 20 years ago |
Guimengo Wrote:
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> Several meanings can be taken out of that sentence
> so if you would please explain...
He's implying that you didn't like rFactor because you don't appreciate that level of sim racing. He is calling you an arcadey type person who knows little about real sims.
Or, Paris @#$%& Picasso and was disappointed by his small cock, simlarly you ... did what to rFactor? Um, yeah. That's what you did. Exactly. Simples.
-------------------------------------------------------
> Several meanings can be taken out of that sentence
> so if you would please explain...
He's implying that you didn't like rFactor because you don't appreciate that level of sim racing. He is calling you an arcadey type person who knows little about real sims.
Or, Paris @#$%& Picasso and was disappointed by his small cock, simlarly you ... did what to rFactor? Um, yeah. That's what you did. Exactly. Simples.
| Registered: 20 years ago |
| Registered: 19 years ago |
Not excited about this. The colors look a bit bland and washed out to me, the pictures I have of the old Spa have proper green terrain and trees. About the sound, what if it's mute not because it's not final, but because they're trying to hide some issue?
The colours look bright and vibrant to me. I don't see any washed out stuff there.
The sound is muted because they are hiding an issue. The issue is the sound isn't finished. Saying that they might be hiding the sound to hide an issue is like saying that the bus is not stopping for the passengers, it's stopping because it's on fire.
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The colours look bright and vibrant to me. I don't see any washed out stuff there.
The sound is muted because they are hiding an issue. The issue is the sound isn't finished. Saying that they might be hiding the sound to hide an issue is like saying that the bus is not stopping for the passengers, it's stopping because it's on fire.
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| Registered: 20 years ago |
loque Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> He's implying that you didn't like rFactor because
> you don't appreciate that level of sim racing. He
> is calling you an arcadey type person who knows
> little about real sims.
You devil you!
It's only after we've lost everything, that we are free to do anything.
-------------------------------------------------------
> He's implying that you didn't like rFactor because
> you don't appreciate that level of sim racing. He
> is calling you an arcadey type person who knows
> little about real sims.
You devil you!
It's only after we've lost everything, that we are free to do anything.
| Moderator Registered: 20 years ago |
And there I was thinking he implied Gui had a small dick...
[www.mediafire.com] Some say you should click it, you know you want to. [www.gp4central.com] <----GP4 Central
[www.mediafire.com] Some say you should click it, you know you want to.
[www.gp4central.com] <----GP4 Central| Registered: 20 years ago |
Way to pull the ignorant and immature comment, Lasse. The only arcadey games I like are Mario Kart and ModNation Racers for your information.
I still think there needs to be a better green for trees and tarmac a little darker. I just want the stock stuff to be top notch, too many recent disappointments have got me a bit down
.
I still think there needs to be a better green for trees and tarmac a little darker. I just want the stock stuff to be top notch, too many recent disappointments have got me a bit down
.| Registered: 20 years ago |
A charge of being crude or insensitive I could most likely understand, and maybe even play guilty to, but ignorant and immature? Come on Gui!
I seem to remember you lauding Codies right after purchase. When Dave pointed out that they used the wrong layout for Silverstone and people didn't even want to hear it, I seem to remember you advising him to sugar coat his critique by saying that the game was "basically solid", but "had some issues". WTF!?!
When this is how you rate crappy arcade games and handle negative assessments of said crappy arcade games, how dare you be so cheeky when faced with the work of Scott Juliano and ISI? Have you even bothered find out what research they have done on the track, and if your "photos" might be inferior material? Disappointed my arse!
If anything, I am dead accurate, straightforward and honest!
It's only after we've lost everything, that we are free to do anything.
I seem to remember you lauding Codies right after purchase. When Dave pointed out that they used the wrong layout for Silverstone and people didn't even want to hear it, I seem to remember you advising him to sugar coat his critique by saying that the game was "basically solid", but "had some issues". WTF!?!
When this is how you rate crappy arcade games and handle negative assessments of said crappy arcade games, how dare you be so cheeky when faced with the work of Scott Juliano and ISI? Have you even bothered find out what research they have done on the track, and if your "photos" might be inferior material? Disappointed my arse!
If anything, I am dead accurate, straightforward and honest!
It's only after we've lost everything, that we are free to do anything.
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