F1′s Missing Heroines

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GPGSL: S6 - TafuroGP Tester (14th) /// S7 - ART Tester (6th) /// S8 - Demon Driver (13th) /// S9 - Demon/Snake Driver (13th) /// S10 - Snake Driver (???) ///]
"My ambition is handicapped by laziness" - Charles Bukowski

Isaint Wrote:
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> People can make their own minds up about what they
> agree with and what they don't agree with
> otherwise we would still be running around
> frightened that we will fall off the edge of the
> planet because we still believe it to be flat.

That is unfortunately provably untrue. In a recent study, social scientists measured how informed Americans were based on their media consumption. As a control they had a group that did not source any news at all. Shockingly, watching Fox News was worse than not having any new source at all. Propaganda works, and it works in every country.

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It's only after we've lost everything, that we are free to do anything.

Incident 2k9

I consider myself properly chastised ....... you are correct of course.


" Perfection is not a gift ....... it comes with practice."

Member of R.S.C.T Group



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/03/2013 06:15PM by Isaint.

When the original article is a piece, that has a section that debates whether or not women have the physique to be successful in F1, then I can't see that debating that women's physical potential is a deviation from the thread topic. As much as I am opposed to Isaint's inclusion of the article from feministing, it is in fact going in depth with a piece of the original article. My counter arguments serve the same function.

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It's only after we've lost everything, that we are free to do anything.

It hasn't though. It's become an argument about what is and isn't a reputable source.

At the end of the day, women have shown that they can physically hack it in motorsports, but there's a dearth of talent because women are dissuaded from motorsports out of tradition. It's a very antiquated system.

Sebastian Vettel has proven you don't need to be an Arnold Schwarzenegger-clone to be physically good enough for F1. I think that, if the talented women can get the financial and career support they deserve...why shouldn't they get a go? If they've got pedigree in junior categories then they're halfway there.

Unfortunately, there's not many to pick from at the moment. As I've mentioned, Beitske Visser is possibly the biggest hope we have for the future. Carmen Jorda has shown in GP3 that she's not really a top prospect (I think she managed to DNQ once...), and Piria doesn't quite have the results either. As for Susie Wolff; I'm sorry to be so cynical, but the reason she's got the Williams "development driver" role is most likely due to her husband's former involvement. Her results in DTM have been lacklustre, and considering there's a great amount of talent with proven results floating around it doesn't suggest she's there on merit.

I think the major problem isn't physical limitations, it's backing and support for the right drivers.

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GPGSL: S6 - TafuroGP Tester (14th) /// S7 - ART Tester (6th) /// S8 - Demon Driver (13th) /// S9 - Demon/Snake Driver (13th) /// S10 - Snake Driver (???) ///]
"My ambition is handicapped by laziness" - Charles Bukowski

What you think is opinion. What you can prove, or source to proof, is fact. Thus, it is essential to analyse what underpins statements and positions. There is a marked difference between opinion and fact, and it is most unfortunate that you are oblivious to it, and the way to discern between them. That truth might be offensive to your sentiments does not make it any less true.

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It's only after we've lost everything, that we are free to do anything.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/04/2013 12:32AM by Morbid.

Vicky Piria definitely has the physique. :P
In all seriousness though, I'll be keeping an eye on her progress. Even if she's not had the race results yet, she could still improve a lot as she gets more experienced.
And yeah, Susie Wolff has benefited from having connections within motorsport, but as has been said already, lack of that very kind of thing is part of what's gone against women being successful in motorsport in general up to now, and most if not all drivers have benefited from it to a greater or lesser extent to get into F1. So fair play to her.

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Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/04/2013 10:29AM by EC83.

I am pretty sure that shagging your top connection in motorsport, is a new invention brought in by her. Then again, sometimes the smile Flavio would have plastered on his face, when he looked at Alonso, made me wonder...

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It's only after we've lost everything, that we are free to do anything.

Dare I say that some women's 'lacklusture' performances are more down to the equipment than the drivers themselves.

For example, Simona de Silvestro. A horrific 2012 season, but only because the Lotus engines were so bad that it was almost like competing in an Indy Lights car against the rest in DW12s. When she switched to KV for this year, she might not have set the world on fire, but she showed a dramatic and immediate improvement over 2012. So something to keep in mind there..

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GPGSL -
GPGSL-3 - Pizza Party Racing manager and driver
Nations Cup - Team Scotland manager

Good to see that since I published this Susie Wolff had the opportunity to test for Williams at the Young Driver Test.

That makes her the first woman to take part in an official timed Formula One session since Amati in 1992.

I can't see her ever getting a drive in F1, but I'd think that it'd be a big inspiration to aspiring female racing drivers, such as Zoe to see her finally get her chance.

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Races: 163 - Wins: 23 - Pole Positions: 24 - Fastest Laps: 22
Season 9: Constructors' Champions

She didn't do badly either - ahead of 3 current F1 drivers. And yes, they were in cars which were arguably slower, but her pace was definitely representative of the Williams.

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Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/21/2013 10:32PM by EC83.

EC83 Wrote:
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> She didn't do badly either - ahead of 3 current F1
> drivers. And yes, they were in cars which were
> arguably slower, but her pace was definitely
> representative of the Williams.

Yeah, that is why her best time was a full second slower than Daniel Juncadella's and Pastor Maldonado's in the same machinery.

Red Bull, Force India, Lotus, Ferrari, Caterham and Marussia all set their fastest times on the Friday Susie Wolff was in the car, so it was hardly the conditions that were to blame for her lack of pace.

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It's only after we've lost everything, that we are free to do anything.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/22/2013 10:51AM by Morbid.

I don't think Susie is quick enough to sustain a career racing in F1, nor is Max Chilton for that matter

From a physical point of view though... She did nearly 90 laps, on a day and week which has seen the hottest conditions in the UK for ages and apparently had few problems and made no mistakes.

This suggests that she'd at least be fit and strong enough to race in F1.

There is a big difference between doing 90 laps, over multiple stints with pauses over the course of a test day, and then doing 52 laps in 1½ hour.

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It's only after we've lost everything, that we are free to do anything.

Morbid schrieb:
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> There is a big difference between doing 90 laps,
> over multiple stints with pauses over the course
> of a test day, and then doing 52 laps in 1½ hour.


But there were women like Vanina Ickx in Le Mans in the past, who did 3 hour stints in an LMP1 sports car. And LMP1 sportscars are about as fast as IndyCars.

Le Mans is a very different beast than F1. And even if you did find one, that would establish the exception to the rule, not the abolishment of the rule. One black swan does not all swans black make!

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It's only after we've lost everything, that we are free to do anything.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/09/2013 07:16PM by Morbid.

IndyCar races are fairly long, aren't they? Also, I believe that, unlike F1, they don't have power steering.

Female drivers seem to survive that, in the least. I know Milka Duno (in particular) has not helped the cause by being a mobile chicane, but occasionally you get a female driver (Danica, de Silvestro...) who makes a name for themselves as a good competitor.

Unfortunatley, until they start winning regularly, the world just isn't going to take them seriously. In my opinion, that's a bit of a shame

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GPGSL -
GPGSL-3 - Pizza Party Racing manager and driver
Nations Cup - Team Scotland manager

The most challenging Mansell was in was the 1993 Michigan 500. He had to be extricated from the car after the race. Of course, Mansell wasn't exactly the fittest to start with, as Ron Dennis would tell you.

Morbid schrieb:
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> Le Mans is a very different beast than F1. And
> even if you did find one, that would establish the
> exception to the rule, not the abolishment of the
> rule. One black swan does not all swans black
> make!

But there has not only been Ickx, but also 9 other women driving in Le Mans since 2000. Of course, far more men took part there during that time. But it's obvious - if you have very few girls in karting, you have very few women at Le Mans, in IndyCars, or in Formula 1.

I just wanted to express that I have difficulties to understand the claim that women aren't physically able to do F1 races, when they can race IndyCars and LMP1 cars, which are almost as fast as F1.

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ScuderiaColoni
I just wanted to express that I have difficulties to understand the claim that women aren't physically able to do F1 races, when they can race IndyCars and LMP1 cars, which are almost as fast as F1.

I'm sure women are fully capable of driving a grand prix distance in a modern F1 car without issue. Whether they have the attributes to be as fast as a guy is very much up for debate (indeed the evidence suggests it's unlikely, even given the lack of women in motorsport—I don't recall any woman winning in a decent category, the closest I can think of on these shores being Sarah Moore in the Ginetta Juniors), but I'm confident they'd be able to drive an F1 car for 200 miles at a time perfectly fine.

I don't have the medical expertise, like Lasse, but I'm fully confident that their physical attributes aren't the restriction.