Simulating the 2014 season - Some thoughts

Posted by TomMK 
Simulating the 2014 season - Some thoughts
Date: February 03, 2014 03:15AM
Posted by: TomMK
So this year there are a lot of changes to F1 that we can try and simulate in GP4. Here's some ideas I've had, feel free to add your own thoughts:

Physics

These three major changes can all be simulated using the Physics .g3p file.

1) Engine torque: More torque because of the turbos and uprated KERS (or whatever it's called these days).

2) Engine RPM: 15000 max rpm, lower than in previous V8 seasons.

3) Car Weight: 690kg. Increased from previous years.

Here is a example physics file which I'll be testing using the 2014 GP4 Central Mod. Download here.

Fuel consumption

Teams are limited to 100kg fuel per race, about 70% the amount of previous seasons (approx 140kg). We can simulate this in the Magic Data for each track by reducing the player and AI fuel consumption values by a similar amount.

In the V8 years I used the following values (numbers in square brackets denote the Magic Data line number):

[70] Player Fuel Consumption = 17200
[71] AI Fuel Consumption = 16000

These were a good starting point and generally produced a good approximation for the racing in the V8 years. So, simplistically, if we take 70% of those values we get approximately (I like round numbers):

[70] Player Fuel Consumption = 12000
[71] AI Fuel Consumption = 11200

The amount of fuel per lap [line 48] (specific to each track) will also need to be reduced by the same percentage.

This needs testing and calibrating to suit each track but it gives a good starting point.

Fixed Gear Ratios

In 2014 each gearbox has 8 forward gears and the ratios are fixed for the whole year. We cannot simulate 8 forward gears because GP4 is limited to a choice of 6 or 7. However, we could simulate fixed gear ratios by simply using the same values in every 2014 Magic Data file. Whether this would bring anything worthwhile the game experience would need more experimentation.

Turbo Failures

A commonly held view is that the 2014 powertrains will not be bulletproof as they have been for several years. So I thought it would be nice to introduce turbo failures as a reason for cars to retire. I think replacing Oil & Water leaks would be most appropriate since you would get the smokey effects of a turbo failure. It should just be a matter of replacing the right text in the various game files.



Qualifying Power

Another race rule for 2014 is the average fuel flow rate cannot exceed 100kg/hour. Well, since the cars can only hold 100kg, that means it's pretty easy to work out that they would run out of fuel after exactly 1 hour if they ran at their maximum. Since races are longer than one hour, it is obvious that the cars will have to run at much less than this during races. But during qualifying, I would expect they will run at the maximum rate allowed for best performance.

All this is a long way of saying the cars will have much more power available during qualifying than the races. This could be simulated in the Performance File by creating a larger difference between qualy and race engine power numbers. Exactly how much would need some experimentation after we see the real world action but, for example, I will start with a value of +20 bhp for qualifying in the 2014 GP4 Central Mod.

So, over to you guys, what other suggestions do you have to bring 2014 F1 to life in GP4?

=====================================================


Intel NUC 8i3, 8GB RAM, MS Sidewinder Wheel
Re: Simulating the 2014 season - Some thoughts
Date: February 03, 2014 11:22AM
Posted by: Bruce D
Well I agree with everything you've said here except possibly the qualifying power. If the race lasted 1h40min (100min) then logically the teams would only be able to use about 80% of their power. Therefore seen as the engines are about 600bhp on their own without ERS or whatever, this would suggest that there would be a 20% increase in power for qualifying, or 120bhp. But what do you set the BHP at because while the engine is producing 600bhp, there is still about 150bhp more coming from ERS for about 33sec a lap. Makes it tricky to work out.
Re: Simulating the 2014 season - Some thoughts
Date: February 03, 2014 01:15PM
Posted by: phantaman
@TomMK

The regulation regarding minimum weight changed and became 691Kg during all the event.

to consult here => [www.fia.com]

I've been testing a physics and power torque curve (turbo, right? found around two power curve originating from HONDA engines and took as base) since the end of November last year with good results.
Yesterday I improved the package, I think that should be the last revision before available to friends from gp4forever and here. ;-)

Bye

----signature--------------------------------------------------------

RELEASE => 2019 physics (under FIA Technical Regulations) !
MagicDatas? Setups? Pit Stop Strategies? Track Specific Performances? Up2Date France GP?
Power Torque Curve? Where's this stuff? All download is available at Upward - GPx !
Re: Simulating the 2014 season - Some thoughts
Date: February 04, 2014 01:30AM
Posted by: TomMK
Thanks for the heads-up about the weight phantaman. I'd be interested to see your 2014 physics when it's ready!

=====================================================


Intel NUC 8i3, 8GB RAM, MS Sidewinder Wheel
Re: Simulating the 2014 season - Some thoughts
Date: February 04, 2014 04:54AM
Posted by: Anonymous User
This topic im interested.
Willing to do some driving and show results in the topic
when Phantaman physics are published.

We can do some tests all together in a designated track. (Y)
Re: Simulating the 2014 season - Some thoughts
Date: February 04, 2014 07:21AM
Posted by: TomMK
Good to have you on-board Jorge!

I think we should designate Jerez (2011 update by xandy), and Bahrain (2013 by Jorge) as our testing tracks, like in real F1 :) We can have our own winter testing sessions.

We will need to produce these files for this to work:

1) A Performance file
2) A Physics file
3) Magic Data files for each track

I have made a start on all of those already, but I'm interested to see phantaman's physics before I go further.

Also, I have succeeded in adding "Turbo Failures" to my game by editing some .str files and gpeadia file, it works really well. I will share those with you also.

=====================================================


Intel NUC 8i3, 8GB RAM, MS Sidewinder Wheel
Re: Simulating the 2014 season - Some thoughts
Date: February 04, 2014 01:32PM
Posted by: phantaman
on a hypothesis of the power torque curve be approximated 730BHP@12600RPM, I have at Jerez:

GP4 Hotlap 1:02 for track 1: jerez
Level: Ace / Frame rate: 22.0 FPS
Race type: Practise Session: Unlimited Practise
Weather type: Custom Probability of rain: 13%
Car # 4, driven by Felipe Massa (Ferrari - Ferrari)
Power: 822 BHP, weight 705 kg, fuel laps: 6.2
Lap time: 1:18.549 (Split1 0:21.884, 0:58.942 SPLIT2)

in the case of approximate 818BHP@14000RPM:

GP4 Hotlap 1:02 for track 1: jerez
Level: Ace / Frame rate: 22.0 FPS
Race type: Practise Session: Unlimited Practise
Weather type: Custom Probability of rain: 13%
Car # 4, driven by Felipe Massa (Ferrari - Ferrari)
Power: 822 BHP, weight 705 kg, fuel laps: 6.2
Lap time: 1:17.161 (Split1 0:21.245, 0:57.784 SPLIT2)

I have to remove a bit of GRIP (maybe in the tires or compare with the standard magicdata track).

PS: tested on a 2013 MOD in ACE mode with corresponding performances and setup

----signature--------------------------------------------------------

RELEASE => 2019 physics (under FIA Technical Regulations) !
MagicDatas? Setups? Pit Stop Strategies? Track Specific Performances? Up2Date France GP?
Power Torque Curve? Where's this stuff? All download is available at Upward - GPx !
Re: Simulating the 2014 season - Some thoughts
Date: February 04, 2014 05:41PM
Posted by: Anonymous User
Sounds good guys.
I think it would be best besides designating the track we say how much fuel
we put in the gas tank before leaving the garages.


After Bahrain they go to Melbourne? or there is another test ?
Havent seen the schedule so i dont know.
Re: Simulating the 2014 season - Some thoughts
Date: February 04, 2014 08:02PM
Posted by: Ferrari2007
I believe the next two tests are both at Bahrain, Jorge.

Then after that, as you say, on to Melbourne.



Races: 163 - Wins: 23 - Pole Positions: 24 - Fastest Laps: 22
Season 9: Constructors' Champions



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/04/2014 08:31PM by Ferrari2007.
Re: Simulating the 2014 season - Some thoughts
Date: February 04, 2014 10:17PM
Posted by: gitanes
The lap times in Jerez can be thrown to the toilet. Everybody was just trying to just check their systems and put their cars together, nobody did a "quali" lap, they probably weren't even running at full revs. What i mean is, calibrating the physics on that numbers is totally wrong, so we can't use Jerez as a test track. I believe, we will have some decent data after the second Bahrain test and, more so, after Melbourne quali (with fuel for 3-4 laps). In any case, i plan to release a first version of the preseason performances after the second Bahrain test.

Furthermore i suggest, we leave, for the time being, the magic data out of the equation (we can make the track specific adjustments later) and concentrate at the fundamental behavior of the 2014 cars.


My personal GP4 files at : www.4shared.com ______ My Blog at : Gitanes GP4 work

* Performance Files * LoadingScreens GoogleMaps * GP4 Tracks and Cars Databases




Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/04/2014 10:28PM by gitanes.
Re: Simulating the 2014 season - Some thoughts
Date: February 05, 2014 02:18AM
Posted by: TomMK
I agree gitanes, the times at Jerez are not representative.

But I think we can say pretty certainly that we would expect them to be faster, and not slower. So we should be setting times faster than 1m 23s (which was set on Day 3 by several cars). That gives us a rough area to aim at, which we can make more accurate as Bahrain and then the Melbourne GP happen.

=====================================================


Intel NUC 8i3, 8GB RAM, MS Sidewinder Wheel
Re: Simulating the 2014 season - Some thoughts
Date: February 05, 2014 03:02AM
Posted by: phantaman
I will give my two cents ...

is common knowledge that no one is accelerating as if in a normal lap. if anyone doubts, just see the times that are on average about 5 seconds slower than a normal lap in this circuit in the past.

the teams don´t use all the power available because don´t want blow up the engine turbo or damage the ERS system. some of them clearly have problems in this regard (redbull).

back on topic ... say that there is a 2014 physics and torque , and this is a clear starting point so we do not go to zero suddenly

or not have to retouch past works, right? what would be a workaround... a "kludge" in english or in good portuguese a "gambiarra". is always good have something new to present ;-)

[]´s

----signature--------------------------------------------------------

RELEASE => 2019 physics (under FIA Technical Regulations) !
MagicDatas? Setups? Pit Stop Strategies? Track Specific Performances? Up2Date France GP?
Power Torque Curve? Where's this stuff? All download is available at Upward - GPx !
Re: Simulating the 2014 season - Some thoughts
Date: February 05, 2014 10:38PM
Posted by: gitanes
I must agree, that the base is an accurate power-torque-curve, which must be based on a horse power figure close to reality (Renault has announced a figure of 760 bhp, rumors say Mercedes has more, so perhaps 780-800 bhp at 15000 U/min would be realistic?). I think, we should agree on a figure to use in all components (torque, physics and performances), to achieve the best results.


My personal GP4 files at : www.4shared.com ______ My Blog at : Gitanes GP4 work

* Performance Files * LoadingScreens GoogleMaps * GP4 Tracks and Cars Databases
Re: Simulating the 2014 season - Some thoughts
Date: February 06, 2014 10:46AM
Posted by: TomMK
So I've created a new torque curve because the cars have no power in the lower rev range otherwise.

I want to turn this into a .cap file so we can use it with CSM but I have no idea how to. Does anyone know?



=====================================================


Intel NUC 8i3, 8GB RAM, MS Sidewinder Wheel
Re: Simulating the 2014 season - Some thoughts
Date: February 06, 2014 11:53AM
Posted by: phantaman
u already have the hardest (which was create the power torque curve), so it is easy to modify another file .cap with these data there using a HEX editor

is what I do ;-)

----signature--------------------------------------------------------

RELEASE => 2019 physics (under FIA Technical Regulations) !
MagicDatas? Setups? Pit Stop Strategies? Track Specific Performances? Up2Date France GP?
Power Torque Curve? Where's this stuff? All download is available at Upward - GPx !
Re: Simulating the 2014 season - Some thoughts
Date: February 06, 2014 12:00PM
Posted by: phantaman
this is a partial power torque curve that I found (the HONDA engines) previously ... then estimate the remaining data was easy



----signature--------------------------------------------------------

RELEASE => 2019 physics (under FIA Technical Regulations) !
MagicDatas? Setups? Pit Stop Strategies? Track Specific Performances? Up2Date France GP?
Power Torque Curve? Where's this stuff? All download is available at Upward - GPx !
Re: Simulating the 2014 season - Some thoughts
Date: February 06, 2014 12:07PM
Posted by: phantaman
Re: Simulating the 2014 season - Some thoughts
Date: February 06, 2014 12:30PM
Posted by: TomMK
oooh yours has even more torque than mine! ;)

I still don't get how to edit the .cap file with a hex editor. I am looking at this, I have no idea what to do:



=====================================================


Intel NUC 8i3, 8GB RAM, MS Sidewinder Wheel
Re: Simulating the 2014 season - Some thoughts
Date: February 06, 2014 12:37PM
Posted by: phantaman
if u rename the cap to a different name I think the CSM (ZaZGP4Tools) not recognized and will not work properly if it is in the corresponding folder (patch)

----signature--------------------------------------------------------

RELEASE => 2019 physics (under FIA Technical Regulations) !
MagicDatas? Setups? Pit Stop Strategies? Track Specific Performances? Up2Date France GP?
Power Torque Curve? Where's this stuff? All download is available at Upward - GPx !
Re: Simulating the 2014 season - Some thoughts
Date: February 06, 2014 12:45PM
Posted by: phantaman
u do not know where (which hex address)? I'll give you a hint ... look at a very old post of my own in gp4forever (consultas/questions) ;-)

PS: and use a different HEX editor (Free Hex Editor Neo by HHD Software)

----signature--------------------------------------------------------

RELEASE => 2019 physics (under FIA Technical Regulations) !
MagicDatas? Setups? Pit Stop Strategies? Track Specific Performances? Up2Date France GP?
Power Torque Curve? Where's this stuff? All download is available at Upward - GPx !
Sorry, only registered users may post in this forum.

Click here to login

Maintainer: mortal, stephan | Design: stephan, Lo2k | Moderatoren: mortal, Vader, stephan | Downloads: Lo2k | Supported by: Atlassian Experts Berlin | Forum Rules | Policy