The Official 2017 Formula One Season *Bahrain Results*

There was Piquet as well in the pre-kers era when turbo and ground effect added themselves producing a mega G-force. Jacarepagua was a killer in that respect.

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Another day, another engine change for Honda.

I wonder how difficult it would have been for Honda to get the jet ignition system working on the 2016 ICE and use that for 4/5 races till the new 2017 power unit was fully tested!

Well they've already changed the engine 4 or 5 times... Each car is supposed to survive with 4 for the entire season. So far Honda have managed 5 days of little to moderate running. Tricky.

168 laps apiece today for Massa and Vettel... That's quite emense. It's pointless reading too much into things at this stage of course but it strikes me that so far the Ferrari has avoided running the softest tyre compounds and still look very competitive lap-time wise. Either they're quick or they've dropped the fuel load.

Massa's pace seems encouraging. As a Williams supporter I'm desperately trying to not get over excited so I've convinced myself that Mercedes have yet to show their hand whilst Red Bull will start steady and then develop rapidly like usual.

I still don't envisage much big change to the competitive order. However, if Ferrari's pace on the harder compounds is as strong as it looks then they could well have played a blinder and whilst I refused to rule that possibility off, I wasn't expecting it either. There's a small chance Williams may have catapulted back to occasional podium contention. McLaren or rather Honda look like they got lost, stopped for directions and ended up going back in the wrong way. Meanwhile Renault might just have sneakily regrouped whilst everyone was looking the other way and Laughing at Honda. The rest are much for a muchness even if the Toro Rosso does looks gorgeous doing it.

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J i m
168 laps apiece today for Massa and Vettel... That's quite emense. It's pointless reading too much into things at this stage of course but it strikes me that so far the Ferrari has avoided running the softest tyre compounds and still look very competitive lap-time wise. Either they're quick or they've dropped the fuel load.

Even the fastest times so far are 2 seconds away from what Pirelli think the fastest times at Barcelona will be in May, so I don't think you can read anything into any of the times until they drop another second at least off the current benchmark, no matter what tyres are being used.

More importantly Ferrari's long run pace looks strong, but we've said that most weekends in the last two seasons only to be sorely disappointed come qualifying and the race.

J i m Wrote:
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> Massa's pace seems encouraging. As a Williams
> supporter I'm desperately trying to not get over
> excited so I've convinced myself that Mercedes
> have yet to show their hand whilst Red Bull will
> start steady and then develop rapidly like usual.

If Williams are to find an opportunity think it will have to be early in the season, don't think they will be able to develop the car at a competitive rate (again). But yes, certainly some encouraging times yesterday!

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X (@ed24f1)

So Alonso is slamming Honda. thatll go down well.

[www.skysports.com]

The fact that he´s saying he can go flat out in almost every curve because the engine has no power says it all. I can´t see the partnership lasting beyond 2017. This Honda team has nothing to do with the 80s and 90s Honda

There were some rumours of a association with BMW in F1, due to their partnership with Mclaren´s street car division. they denied it but I wonder if that can become true in the future.

I don't think we'll see another manufacturer in F1 unless the rules change. There's just too much risk of 'doing a Honda' versus the colossal costs associated. From a performance point of view I love these engines but from a sporting point of view I hate them.

The FIA and FOM backed themselves into a corner when they gave the teams total power. Revert to naturally aspirated and Mercedes and Renault will leave overnight - we're left with a Ferrari-only sport. Keep the current units and we're at risk of Mercedes leaving anyway (as they can only lose from here on in) and Renault leaving (as they do every few years) - we're still left with a Ferrari-only sport. Honda don't count as they'll be off in the next couple of years anyway if this marketing disaster continues.

What are we going to do? Crank open a shed of old DFVs? FOM have some important discussions coming in the next 6 months. I suspect as a happy medium we'll end up with a 1.8-2.0L V6/V8 turbo in 2020, minus the energy recovery, in the hope that other manufacturers will be attracted back by slightly less complex rules. Hopefully with far less optimised engine maps to give the drivers a tougher time.

Still, as much as I want a sporting contest, I also hate levelling the playing field - this isn't the BTCC, this is the top-tier of motorsport, a manufacturing showboat and has been since Grand Prix racing started, but it's a hard watch at the moment, and I'll not be forking out when the UK goes Sky-exclusive next year.

gav Wrote:
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> I'll not be forking out when the UK
> goes Sky-exclusive next year.

thw formula1 subreddit comes in handy for that

Frantic Wrote:
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> The fact that he´s saying he can go flat out in
> almost every curve because the engine has no power
> says it all.

You can't be serious. That was tongue in cheek and a classic Alonso jab at Honda like "GP2 engine" to get them to get their sh!t together. Obviously the vast majority of corners ARE NOT taken flat with the Honda engine!

gav Wrote:
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> I don't think we'll see another manufacturer in F1
> unless the rules change. There's just too much
> risk of 'doing a Honda' versus the colossal costs
> associated. From a performance point of view I
> love these engines but from a sporting point of
> view I hate them.

Spot on.

> The FIA and FOM backed themselves into a corner
> when they gave the teams total power. Revert to
> naturally aspirated and Mercedes and Renault will
> leave overnight - we're left with a Ferrari-only
> sport.

Yep, Todt practically said so the other day.

> What are we going to do? Crank open a shed of old
> DFVs? FOM have some important discussions coming
> in the next 6 months. I suspect as a happy medium
> we'll end up with a 1.8-2.0L V6/V8 turbo in 2020,
> minus the energy recovery, in the hope that other
> manufacturers will be attracted back by slightly
> less complex rules. Hopefully with far less
> optimised engine maps to give the drivers a
> tougher time.

Minus the energy recovery won't happen from a FIA point of view. Todt has been very clear on the green image of F1 and setting a global example. He also talked about hydrogen cars, and driverless cars for rallying. As I said previously, AI motorsport is coming.

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It's only after we've lost everything, that we are free to do anything.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/09/2017 02:03PM by Morbid.

@Morbid of course Alonso didn´t said that seriously! What I was trying to emphasize in the other post is that he´s already being ironic in pre-season. He´s already fed up with the situation. It´s obvious they are not taking all the corners flat, they have a horrible engine but still it isn´t from a lawnmover! Furthermore, there are reports on how they lift in corners 1-2-3 because the car also has handling issues (that exist probably due to the engine, too).

@gav I agree with you, they have to change the rules soon if they don´t want F1 to implode. The fact that Ross Brawn is implied on the sporting side gives me some hope that they´ll simplify the rulebook a lot in the next few years. They probably will have to do it not only with manufacturers already inside F1, though.

Frantic Wrote:
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> @Morbid of course Alonso didn´t said that
> seriously! What I was trying to emphasize in the
> other post is that he´s already being ironic in
> pre-season. He´s already fed up with the
> situation. It´s obvious they are not taking all
> the corners flat, they have a horrible engine but
> still it isn´t from a lawnmover! Furthermore,
> there are reports on how they lift in corners
> 1-2-3 because the car also has handling issues
> (that exist probably due to the engine, too).

I saw those reports, that the car has problems getting proper purchase while cornering. They came out pretty early from trackside observation. AFAIK Boullier flat out denied that was the case. So he basically planted all blame on Honda, while later mentioning they also had to do their job, being totally vague about where those problems are. If the car has handling issues, I would say, that message from Boullier is ominous. When you start blaming your partner for your own problems in the media, then splits are not far off... because you are really just using them in a PR stunt for positioning for the future. I would also say, I don't think we should expect Alonso to be super joyous about an offer of contract renewal. Mercedes contacted him before they picked up Bottas, and as far as I understood it, he didn't say no. He said "I am under contract". I read that as "let's talk more during the season as it unfolds". I could be wrong, but that is how I understood it.

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It's only after we've lost everything, that we are free to do anything.

Yeah, I also think like that regarding Alonso. I think that is the reason of keeping Button under contract, so they have a plan b if Alonso leaves. I don´t think any of the top drivers would want a seat at McLaren today.

It´s like the tree doesn´t let them see the forest. I´m sure that if they drop the Honda engine and put a Mercedes inside the car it still wouldn´t be better than 4th.

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Morbid
I would also say, I don't think we should expect Alonso to be super joyous about an offer of contract renewal. Mercedes contacted him before they picked up Bottas, and as far as I understood it, he didn't say no. He said "I am under contract". I read that as "let's talk more during the season as it unfolds". I could be wrong, but that is how I understood it.

Which is one of the reasons why Bottas has only been given an initial one year deal.

I suspect the other reasons are called "Vettel" and "Verstappen".

I fully expect Alonso to be in a Mercedes next year.

I expect that too....right when Mercedes are no longer the dominant force, just to piss Alonso off even more lol!

So, Force India have changed their colours... to pink.
[www.espn.co.uk]


Thoughts?





Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/14/2017 03:46PM by Laton.

Auto-Motor-Sport.de has an interesting article online comparing this year's wheel base and rake.

Apparently the Mercedes ist the longest car (about 5 meters) with a wheel bse of 3.760mm (compared to 3.5 over the last years). It also has the lowest rake.

Red Bull
WB :3.557 m
Rake: 1.5°

Ferrari
WB: 3.594 m
Rake: 1.6°

Force India
WB: slightly shorter than the Mercerdes
Rake: 2.1° (highest of all)

Williams
WB: 3.545 m (shortest car)
Rake: 1.7°

McLaren, Torro Rosso
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Haas
WB: like Ferrari
Rake: slighlty more than Ferrari

Renault
WB: slightly shorter (!) than last year)
Rake: first 1.0°, now 1.7°

Sauber
WB: 3.550 m
Rake: 1,3°

[www.auto-motor-und-sport.de]

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REHAB IS FOR QUITTERS



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/14/2017 03:06PM by Vader.

Quote
Laton
Thoughts?

Nice to see a different colour on the grid, but it's a cartoon-like implementation, which isn't to my taste. The engine cover looks nice, but the rest is poor in my opinion.

British members will remember, with a degree of horror, Mr Blobby. In some ways this feels the same.

Hahaha.

I agree Gav, it's nice to see a car with a new colour, but I'm not a fan of the way they've done it. The shade of pink itself is a really nice colour but I don't like the lines they've put on there. It would look way better if it was pure pink with no 'go faster stripes', imo.

Also, about the wheelbase - I know people have said for years that the cars are getting too long, but I realised something the other day (err, actually, the other year). I think a shorter car length would increase the sensation of speed dramatically. If you watch a motogp bike go down a straight, it looks way faster than an F1 car, even though they're doing roughly the same speed. Why? Because bikes are tiny compared to cars. Another reason I'd like to see shorter cars in F1.

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