Official 2016 Mexican Gp thread ***SPOILERS***

As we all know by now - if Rosberg hopes to win the championship today, he HAS to win, with Hamilton finishing 10th or lower.

No matter the outcome, I can't shake the feeling that today is when the championship is decided. Wow, am I looking forward to this. And what better place than Mexico!

My thoughts:

- If Hamilton wins, then he will carry on the momentum and Rosberg will bottle it. Hamilton --> champion.

- if Rosberg wins, then Hamilton has virtually no chance. Rosberg --> champion.

- if Hamilton wins with Rosberg 2nd, then that's pretty much the only situation where the championship will stay in the balance.

Of course, it's not that simple really. Anything could happen. But whoever wins today will break their teammate mentally, I reckon.

Bring it on!

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You know you want to. [judgegrudge.mybrute.com]

Chaotic start when I saw the McLaren go onto the grass on the 2nd straight (I think it was Alonso) I thought we were about to see an enormous crash

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X (@ed24f1)

The last 2-3 laps and podium build-up certainly created a lot of talking points even if the middle of the race was quiet!

Can't believe Vettel is more petulant now than his Red Bull days...

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X (@ed24f1)

Verstappen needs a race ban or he won't learn. Great driver, but also very dirty.

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REHAB IS FOR QUITTERS

I have criticised him in the past and I have thought that some of his on-track antics have been marginal, to say the least. However, I agree with everything he said here - there was no penalty for Hamilton, there was no penalty for Seb for squeezing Ricciardo. There is no consistency. Furthermore, Seb is out of order, he's behaving like an idiot and taking how inept Ferrari is right now on everybody else.

This neverending "someone else wasn't punished so I should not be penalised as well" really annoys me. If it is against the rules (and it was) then it has to be penalised, irrespective of what happened elsewhere. Maybe Ham should have gotten some sort of warning or even 5 secs but that's a different story.
Vettel vs Ricciardo, I think Seb left one car's width at all times, it was on the edge but I can see why this went unpunished.

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used to be GPGSL's Nick Heidfeld

and now Vettel is penalised too ( I wouldn´t be surprised if I wake up tomorrow and the 3rd place belongs to Palmer).

Maybe the move on Ricciardo was a little over the edge. In my opinion it wasn´t an illegal move.
But what bothers me most is Verstappen´s way too arrogant behaviour, even for a 18 years old. He knew he was wrong and he didn´t give the place back (allowing Ricciardo to put more pressure on Vettel with the known outcome btw).
He already had problems with the two Ferrari drivers and with Hamilton, and I think it would be a serious issue if he really thinks that he´s always right and the others are wrong.

Regarding the cutting-the-first-corner issue, I think Lewis should´ve been penalised but it was the first lap and inmediately there was a safety car so arguably you can say he didn´t gain an advantage. What he and Verstappen should had done was what Perez did in a passage of his fight with Massa: braking late and then trying to take the 2nd and 3rd corners instead of skipping them.





Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/31/2016 01:46AM by Frantic.

Mainly dull race that suddenly exploded into life at the end, and very interesting podium ceremony.

I love Seb to bits, but his comments over the radio during races are starting to get silly. Telling the Race Director to @#$%& off is OTT, and his comments in the past race interview were surprising too. It's like he's gotten possessed this weekend(Although asking if he could go for a wee during qualifying was a classic Seb moment). What surprises me is that he's suddenly becoming like this after a long time in F1, so it's not age or experience related. The drop-off in performance at Ferrari is clearly bothering him, but this venom is something new, and it's giving me "Woah!" moments.

Naturally, as Ted Kravitz touched on in his post-race Notebook, it's all relative - we might've been even more shocked if we'd had the Team Radio feature when other greats were driving in the past. But still... Woah.

The situation between Verstappen(And RedBull in general) and the Ferrari drivers is starting to get really entertaining though. There hasn't been tension like this in F1 since Alonso/Hamilton at Macca.

I disagree that Verstappen should get a race ban though. He's pushing the limits of what's acceptable, but it's not stupidity like Grosjean was showing a few years ago. Max is being consistent and stable in what he does, and I appreciate it rubs some up the wrong way, but overall I don't think his driving is dangerous, because he has the exceptional skills to control the car on the very limit. If he deserves a ban then so did Senna, Mansell, Montoya etc.
I love his refusal to back down or change his approach too.

Interesting race statistically for (1) Seb surpassing Prost for overall laps led, (2) Lewis equalling Prost for overall race wins and (3) Lewis equalling Schumacher's record for number of race wins at different circuits(which he could now surpass next time out in Brazil).

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Edited 5 time(s). Last edit at 10/31/2016 03:13AM by EC83.

Seb's choice of words may appear immature, but it shows the passion he has for what he's doing. There are a lot of spineless Eccelstone c*cksuckers out there and here's a man who speaks his mind. We need more of that.

Verstappen should have been punished races ago. In fact he should have been punished right after the start this Sunday. He's talented, but it's only fun and games until someone loses an eye.

I don't really think Vettel deserved the penalty, because all he did was evading Verstappen and trying to avoid a collision after he got brake tested again. It's a completely different situation than zig-zagging all over the place and braking in random places while moving over like Verstappen does.

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REHAB IS FOR QUITTERS

Seb, is a driver who got very used to winning very early in his career and he still hasn't quite come to terms that someone else happens to be winning at the moment.

Yes we love him because he's charismatic and has a sense of humour on him.... he's also a whinging cry baby and has been developing this tendency to throw tantrums ever since lifting the 2010 championship. He always vents his frustrations very visibly when things don't quite go his way. This is the same whether his car breaks down prompting him to sling his gloves against a fence to being slightly held up by a backmarker in which he wastes no time in screaming 'blue flag' allied with any amount of abuse down the radio.

He went to Ferrari because he somewhat sees himself as an aire to Michael Schumacher. For all his flaws... it's difficult imagining Schumacher behaving like that although we did have less coverage of radio communication back then.

Ferrari for their part seem to be a team who have reverted to their late 80s early 90s state where politics and scapegoating are dominating engineering and strategy. Long gone are the reminents of Todt, Brawn & Bryne.

The race itself was a bit of a slow burner. The climax between Verstappen, Riccardo and the boy Vettel was exciting and hilarious in equal measures. The track had lost all of its former character as well.

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It's only after we've lost everything, that we are free to do anything.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/01/2016 07:03PM by Morbid.

I do wonder if Seb is feeling the supposed pressure of being a Ferrari driver. The Seb of 2016 isn't the Seb that we know, he's been cranky all the way through the season, worsening as the season develops.

He was always willing to say what he feels, but it was usually constructive. We know underneath that jovial exterior (much, much less of that in 2016) that he was hard as anyone and he'd do what's needed to win, but this season he's been so easily frustrated and even seething and Ferrari have never even been close to a title challenger - what would he have been like if he was in the running for the title this year?

I worry about Seb. I think he's struggling with something in his life and it's not having a positive effect.

I imagine as previously suggested that it is down to the fact that he has won four titles with relative ease (sorry but they were relatively easy) and he seems to have this air of entitlement to him because of that. The way he speaks about fellow drivers, particularly about blue flags, is way too aggressive.

With Max, it's simple. Vettel sees someone coming up the ranks who is younger than he was and better than he was, and I think he is terrified that due to the current Mercedes dominance and the almost inevitable success of people like Verstappen and Ricciardo not even taking into account any more titles Mercedes will win, he thinks he may not win another title. And he may be right.

He is also a massive hypocrite and I think when he looks back in a few years time he will regret what he has said and he will regret how he is behaving. And he does deserve punishment for how he spoke to Charlie, in all honesty. Seb really isn't the best driver when it comes to wheel-to-wheel combat. Look how many incidents he's been involved in this year particularly at the start of races, Belgium and also a couple of races ago where he hit Hamilton I think it was and wrecked his suspension. Don't forget how he took out Webber, how he wiped out Button and tangled needlessly with Kubica in his earlier Red Bull days?? Max has only had one major collision so far and that was into the back of Grosjean at Monaco. It was a stupid mistake and one he hasn't repeated, yet.

I do think we will see a race-ending collision between Seb and Max or possibly Ricciardo soon though, and don't forget about Kimi and Max also. It's quite exciting, they're all winding each other up and it's going to be quite amusing to see what happens.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/01/2016 11:23PM by Laton.

In my opinion Verstappen had only one major collision more due to the drivers he´d been wheel to wheel than because of his driving itself. For instance I´m sure he´d crashed in Hungary and Belgium if he was racing against someone that isn´t as fine as Kimi.

Vettel is frustrated? Yes he is. But he´s not a robot. And also the radio thing exagerates it all. I remember Spa 98, the Schumacher-Coulthard incident. Im sure MS wasn´t saying "oh what a pity, this is unfortunate" while storming to the McLaren pits to confront DC.

Goodness knows that Michael Schumacher had his flaws, but it's very difficult to imagine him launching a radio attack on Charlie Whiting knowing not only that he can hear it but that it's also broadcast on the TV feed.

That clip that Morbid posted above is hilarious, it reminded me of me throwing tantrums when I lost at F197 on the PlayStation or something

Disappointed that they didn't take a stand and give him a reprimand at least. Telling an official to #$@% off in many other sports would give you a few weeks holiday ...

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X (@ed24f1)

While Vettel's comment to Whiting was over the top, I still think much of the teamradio messages are overhyped. We only get them broadcasted to this extent for a few seasons now, so there isn't really any reference to previous generations of drivers. I'd be surprised if the likes of Coulthard, Schumacher, Montoya, Webber were always calm when talking to their engineers during the race. And that's only looking as far back as the previous generation. MSC-DC at Sap '98 has already been mentioned, then there was Coulthard's middlefinger at Magny-Cours that comes to mind, MSC-MON at Monaco under Safety Car, Multi 21 or Istanbul 2010.

Also they need to sort out the track limits and inconstancy of stewards' decisions stuff, it's just ridiculous at this point. One driver gets away with it, the next one is punished for the very same thing. Drivers don't even seem to try to stay on track in certain situations, simply because they know there won't be much damage if they go off. No gravel traps that might damage the car, just tarmac that'll lose them 1 second at most.

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Some mods
F1 1996 | F1 2002 | F1 2007 | F1 2011 | F1 2013 | F1 2015 | F1 2018

In this case the grass was almost worse than tarmac as on tarmac they could have put some of the speed humps down or forced drivers to take a slower route as with the final chicane at Montreal.

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X (@ed24f1)

Personally I don't see anything hilarious about that Seb video, to me it just suggests that someone had too much time on their hands... Each to their own I guess.


gav Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I do wonder if Seb is feeling the supposed
> pressure of being a Ferrari driver. The Seb of
> 2016 isn't the Seb that we know, he's been cranky
> all the way through the season, worsening as the
> season develops.
>
> He was always willing to say what he feels, but it
> was usually constructive. We know underneath that
> jovial exterior (much, much less of that in 2016)
> that he was hard as anyone and he'd do what's
> needed to win, but this season he's been so easily
> frustrated and even seething and Ferrari have
> never even been close to a title challenger - what
> would he have been like if he was in the running
> for the title this year?
>
> I worry about Seb. I think he's struggling with
> something in his life and it's not having a
> positive effect.

This.
I think Ferrari's dip in form might have more to do with Sergio Marchionne than anyone else. There's no proof of course, but his arrival as CEO has roughly coincided with them suddenly struggling after a promising 2015. He's apparently known for being uncompromising and difficult. I get the feeling he's been putting pressure on the team to achieve results and it's ended up being counterproductive.
The effect of this on Seb's demeanour is that he might well be feeling some kind of personal responsibility for the loss of performance as the lead driver, and that is what's really been bothering him this year.

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Both Horner and Ricciardo have publically stated that Vettel was never like this at Red Bull. I don't think that the major problem is Ferrari's dip in form, although it contributes. What I think is up, is that the current situation is screwing up his whole self-perception as the man that is the successor of MS. I think the most telling episode was in free practice, when he mouthed off at Alonso over the radio. You don't HAVE to move over in FP, it is a unspoken gentleman's conduct and agreement. And here he is, behind a driver that most still rate better than him, who has a mountain to climb that is much higher than Vettel's, and who has less time to do it in, and who really NEEDS that data given the woes of Honda+McLaren, and he is calling him an idiot, because he just doesn't vanish into thin air at the twisty bits of the track, when the God King of F1 arrives on the scene. How much of a God King of F1 are you, when you are close to being beaten by your team mate in the waning years of his career? Truely, how much has Vettel ever had to contemplate the very real possibility, that he might finish the season behind his team mate, that he utterly obliterated just the year before?

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It's only after we've lost everything, that we are free to do anything.