The Official 2016 Bahrain Grand Prix Thread ***SPOILERS with quali rules FIAscos yet again!***

fast posting, may i put some details later.

Alonso not racing, it has been revealed he had a broken rib and pneumothorax, will be replaced by Vandoorne





Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 04/01/2016 03:46AM by Frantic.

Hardly ideal preparation for Vandoorne, having to fly in from Japan the day before practice.

Odd of McLaren and Alonso not to ensure Vandoorne wasn't with them if there was even a hint that Alonso might not be fit enough. Probably Alonso's never-ending determination getting the better of him, because there's no way he wouldn't be in pain, and you have to think that if McLaren knew that then Vandoorne would be with them.

At first I thought it was the typical race miss after a concussion, to avoid a second one. This is much more serious, although it was pretty obvious he couldn't have resulted unscathed after that. Just the first lateral impact should have been enough to harm him, add to that a whole flip in the air, and thankfully it hit the wall back first.

Never was and never will be my favourite driver but boy Fernando is a crazy monster. If the doctors hadn't stopped him, he would have raced. That's true love for the sport. And the fact remains that Honda have definitely improved quite a lot.

I'm betting a top 10 for Stoffel if the car doesn't let him down. Nobody dominates GP2 without a fair share of raw talent.



Stats: 139 Starts / 7 Wins / 9 Poles / 5 Fastest laps

Goes to show that risk management is so much stricter today, gone are the days that a Mansell would be allowed to race despite a broken back, foot or concussion of some sort.

Last driver I can recall racing with injuries is Coulthard who had broken ribs following his plane crash.

J i m Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Goes to show that risk management is so much
> stricter today, gone are the days that a Mansell
> would be allowed to race despite a broken back,
> foot or concussion of some sort.
>
> Last driver I can recall racing with injuries is
> Coulthard who had broken ribs following his plane
> crash.


Webber raced with minor fractures around 2012 or 2013 but the team never knew until long after he healed.



Stats: 139 Starts / 7 Wins / 9 Poles / 5 Fastest laps

P.S. i am not an alonso fan, quite the opposite since I always cheered for schumi

johnny herbert said alonso should retire :

[www.skysports.com]

I think this is the most ridiculous and flawed argument I have EVER heard , at least from herbert. So he say, he doesn't see that drive and desire in alonso? did he watch Hungary qualyfing last year, or not? How about the race afterwards. Oh, and maybe he didnt watch the 2014 season either, when Alonso trashed Raikkonen. I study digital marketing, and yes, sometimes you have to be controversial to drive traffic and sharing of your content, but this is just ridiculous.

For example, herbert says:

I know things have changed as far as the cars are concerned, but as far as performance is concerned we haven't seen this two-time world champion that everyone says is the best. I don't see it. And we haven't seen domination at McLaren and Jenson [Button] has done a better job


Yeah, sure, according to this judgement button is a no benchmark. Well, where was herbert when button was beating lewis; when lewis was crashing every other race etc.? I didnt hear herbert cry out for lewis retiring.

Another example from the article,

"He's commented that he'd be happy to leave F1 with two world championships - that is a man who has not just given up the chance of winning another, but that effectively is giving up on racing."

What? The guy said he is happy with having 2 titles, and can live without a third one, so herbert concludes, alonso has given up on racing:? This is insane. I so wished the comments section was enabled below the article.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/02/2016 11:39AM by mitadumapaga.

Please can some one kindly give Bernie Ecclestone a slap in the face with a wet smelly fish.

Or better yet, make him retire.

Yes, please. It seems like he wants to destroy what he's built, cause he doesn't want anyone to gain profit because of his work.
Well, let's see if Hulk is going to be the last driver on the track this session...

And that's Q3, now Q4 with Ferrari and Merc :D

Haas are embarrassing other teams. Outstanding.

Kvyat, wat?

xSilvermanx Wrote:
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> And that's Q3, now Q4 with Ferrari and Merc :D


LOLLLzzz

Well.. it wasn't quite as drastically as bad as Melbourne but it's clear that this format simply doesn't work. Perhaps it could work if they had a tyre which lasted long enough without performance dedge to allow the cars to run throughout each session. But that just goes to prove that this simply wasn't thought through.

Some parts of qualifying today were ok. But it sucks that the circumstances limit many cars to a single qualifying attempt.

Notable performances today... Hass. When was the last time a completely new startup team came in and was immediately top ten competive? Also Pascal thingy... P16 basically on merit. Massive improvement for manor.

I think Brundle is right, the overal depth of quality of constructors, teams and drivers has never been better. What a shame the sport is run by abunch of tossers.

J i m Wrote:
>
> I think Brundle is right, the overal depth of
> quality of constructors, teams and drivers has
> never been better. What a shame the sport is run
> by abunch of tossers.

Like

I can recall Stewart in 1997 only, when they had the best Ford engine but they werent this good. Maybe Sabuer? Its nice that they´re showing that you can build a team and be competitive, a 180° turn in the message the 3 newcomers gave in 2010...

The qualy system is awful. Grosjean was cheering for Hulkenberg so he was eliminated in Q2 and could start with fresh tyres. I still think thats not sense of competence. Qualy has to be flat out and be the quickest possible and thats why I still think the 1 hour 12 laps is the best system as I said in another topic.

The quality of today´s cars is incredible, look at the reliability and compare it to the 80s when only 5 or 6 cars ended races sometimes! May it has something to do the parc ferme lockup as the teams cant dismantle and reassemble the cars to check them during night as before. Perhaps that was the cause of so many failures

I think the reliability is down to a combination of things. Firstly the advance of technology in that the manufacturing of the components will have developed considerbly over time with newer and stronger materials being found. Plus in recent years the regulations stipulating that engines and gearboxes etc last longer and tha the competive environment has pushed along the engineering and preparation side of it.

With my rose tinted retro specs on, I too would advocated for a return to the 12 lap qualifying format. I know the hour long session had empty track periods but that also helped increase the sense of anticipation at the end. Plus you knew the quickest laps would most likely come at the end as the track rubbered in.

J i m Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

> With my rose tinted retro specs on, I too would
> advocated for a return to the 12 lap qualifying
> format. I know the hour long session had empty
> track periods but that also helped increase the
> sense of anticipation at the end. Plus you knew
> the quickest laps would most likely come at the
> end as the track rubbered in.


I've been pondering what an alternative system might be that would provide the following two objectives, which in my mind are the only two things that should be considered:
1. Get cars on track - people are paying money to watch cars and not an empty track
2. Work out who is the fastest in the purest way with as few gimmicks as possible

So... what do you think of the following:
1. 4 x 12 minute sessions = 48 minutes. Current regs provide in theory at least for 45 minutes of track time), with three 4 minute gaps in between = 60 mins total
2. Each driver must set a timed lap within each 12 minute session, with no driver eliminated at any stage
3. No limit on number of laps you can do, but you must do at least one timed lap per session
4. If you fail to set a timed lap in any session, you get sent to the back
5. The only thing I'd keep is that you need to start the race on the set of tires you set your fastest lap on
6. Whilst the only 'gimmicky' thing that could maybe included is a guarantee if you finish P1 in a session, you secure a slot within the top 4 of the grid to ensure people still push if conditions change during the sessions. So for example if you top Q1 you're guaranteed a spot in the top 4, regardless if during the other sessions every other driver beats that time.

So you'd get everyone on track at least four times throughout the hour, you get three gaps for commercial breaks on TV, multiple chances for a true pole shoot out, reward for pushing throughout the hour and unless there's changing conditions it *should* still build to a natural crescendo at the end of what would be Q4.

Thoughts?


back to this particular race - hoping Rosberg nails the start and then bottles Hamilton and Vettel up behind him so the three of them can duke it out, with Kimi maybe sniffing around too. Great lap by Danny Ric, he looks to be in sparkling form.

I think in the short term reverting back to the 2015 spec qualifying is the most sensible solution. It was working fine for current set of technical regulations.

If F1 absolutely insists upon changing qualifying substantially in the future then it should be designed around and in conjunction with the technical regulations. As I said previously this musical chair elimination style qualify could possibly work only if the cars could be on the track throughout the whole session without having to pit for tyres. That way the 90 seconds for the car on the bubble to react could work quite well and be fun. But no with these current era tyres which are designed to lose performance after only a couple of laps.

The biggest problem at the moment is that F1 simply does not know what it wants to be at the moment and it's governance is pulling it in too many different directions at the same time. It's a massive shame because it's wasting a field full of supremely high quality constructors and drivers.

Personally I think it's time for a complete sweep out. The FIA, FOM, Commission, strategy group... What ever. It's just a complete mess.

Bernie. I'm sorry but it's past your time to go now. You've done an incredible amount of good for F1 but what you're doing these days is akin to removing the bottom bricks of jenga. It's just going to collapse. Give the reins to someone who understands where the modern social networking society is going.

Jean Todt... Is simply far too disinterested. He's too weak, he just wants to keep everyone happy which is impossible and in the meantime he's more focuses on road safety anyway.

Strategy group? Get rid of it. Not fit for purpose. Teams and drivers should not make the rules although it would be wise to consult them.
Historic bonus payments? Ridiculous. Tear up the contracts and distribute the bonus revenue evenly between the teams whilst resting a sliding scale of prize money for merit.

Technical leadership? Invite Ross Brawn. He's an inordinately sensibly clever man. He could provide good direction for F1 and he's strong enough to push things through. Beg Max Mosley to come aboard in a consultant role. He may not be popular but he's indecently clever and processes the strength to lead and get things done.

Open up the technical regs, encourage variety and competition but restrict overall spending so that the independents can compete.

to be fair the idea of the elimination isn't bad per se. It's a system that existed way before (even though I only know it through various racing games; that mode provides some fun and thrilling races) and that could possibly work. I actually kind of like the idea, even after those desastrous qualifying-sessions.

One problem that makes the sessions desastrous is the tyres. Has been pointed out before, if the tyres could work for an entire session the qualifying could be better.
Another problem is that once you've made your lap, you don't seem to have the time to do a second run if you're the first one to get kicked out (with current tyres). This means the slowest driver at the beginning of the session automatically bites the dust.

Both of these problems would be solvable (may it be special qualifying-tyres you're obligated to use or the like). However there is one problem that in my opinion makes this system incompatible if (current) F1. If we look at the qualifying-results from Bahrain, we see (teams sorted alphabetically):
0.5 gap Mercedes to Ferrari
0.5 gap Ferrari to Red Bull/Williams
0.5 gap Red Bull/Williams to ForceIndia/Haas/McLaren/ToroRosso
0.5 gap ForceIndia/Haas/McLaren/ToroRosso to Manor/Renault/Sauber

Now while the teams might switch a group depending on the track (ToroRosso was the third fastest team in Melbourne) these huge gaps between single teams always exist. This results in the faster teams only driving one lap at the beginning of Q1/Q2 to avoid elimination (rather than driving at the end to avoid elimination) and then staying in the garage because they are already qualified.
To amplify this problem most teams are satisfied with the position they have qualified in their single run and won't drive another lap
a) in order to save tyres;
b) because they may not be able to improve enough to get into the next qualifying session and thus rather save tyres than get a grid-position one place higher (it's not worth too much, is it?);
c) because they already dropped out and aren't allowed to try again (this happened to Haas in Melbourne and will happen to other teams and drivers). Those that made a small mistake in their run can't improve because they are out. While this is intended in order to mix up the grid, the unintended side-effect is that it makes for less driving in the last minutes as those drivers that want to improve and get into the next session are already eliminated from the qualification;
d) because they could be PUNISHED by driving faster! This is the worst thing that can happen in a qualifying and is a general problem of F1, however Bahrain 2016 has shown this explicitly, live and uncensored on camera. Grosjean cheering for Hulkenberg to overtake him, Hulkenberg actively trying to get P9, then reacting disappointed when he's told he's 8th and hoping for someone to overtake him. BIG thumbs down on this one. I won't blame the teams for this one, they want to maximize the results. And if P9 is better than P8 for race-strategy they will aim for P9, not the highest grid-position possible.


Now reading my opinion on problems of the new qualifying I'm thinking this could all apply to the 2015-system as well. My fear is that returning to the old system will not change much in Q1 and Q2 as teams apply their acquired knowledge and just don't drive. I don't really know if this is realistic or not...

Here's hoping for a return to the old system (I love gareth's suggestion btw) while dropping the rule on starting tyres for Q3-participants and giving out free tyres for qualification, alternatively applying the rule on starting tyres to Q1 and Q2 as well. That way P9 will be worse than P8 again.


And a last thought: IMO the elimination-system is incompatible with (current) F1. However I'd love to see DTM or the like try it. Having all cars lapping within 1 second could see some exiting qualification, as everyone needs to constantly drive in order to not get eliminated. My only fear is that with only two drivers on track the end of Q3 could be quite boring. But I'd love to see a try.

What an amazing start! Chaos FTW.

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What a lucky escape for lewis. Can't see why bottas had to be penalised but who asks me.

How did eilliams sink so badly down the order after being second and third into turn 3???