Alonso in the mix for Red Bull drive
Posted by madotter
Red Bull team principal Christian Horner has refused to deny he is in talks to bring Fernando Alonso to his team next year to partner Sebastian Vettel.
Mark Webber will leave Formula One at the end of the year, leaving a vacant seat at the three-time world champions in 2014. Kimi Raikkonen and Daniel Ricciardo were thought to be the two strongest candidates, but over the Hungarian Grand Prix weekend Horner was seen in talks with Alonso's manager Luis Garcia Abad.
With Alonso contracted to Ferrari until 2016 it's possible Abad was talking to Horner about Red Bull young driver Carlos Sainz Jr, who he also represents. However, by Sunday evening the rumour in the paddock was that Alonso is being lined up as a potential replacement for Webber and when Horner was pushed on the issue he did not take the opportunity to deny it.
"Any conversation between any of the drivers or parties is going to remain confidential," he said. "But of course there are quite a lot of drivers who have expressed interest in the seat, as you can imagine."
He added: "I think we're in a fortunate position where we have quite a lot of interest in the seat next year. We were able to have a good look at Daniel [Ricciardo] last week [at the Silverstone test] and we'll take a bit of time over the summer to reflect on the options that are open us and look to put the right driver alongside Sebastian next year.
"The situation is that we want to run the strongest team. We're a team that has won the world championship for the last three years and we want to compete and fight for the world championship in future years. There has never been a pressure to run a junior driver it's a matter of fielding the best team at the end of the day. Of course the junior drivers are under consideration but there is not a prerequisite it has to be a junior driver."
Asked whether he thought a partnership of Alonso and Vettel would work, Horner said: "It would be interesting. I think at the end of the day you have to think about what's right for the team and the pairing that we want to put together next year has to be right for the team.
"Last week it was speculation about Kimi and now it's about Fernando. For us we want to make sure that nothing wavers in our mind about putting the right package together for next year. We need the two fastest drivers we can get that work collectively well together and secure the best results for the team."
As much as I'd like to see Ricciardo in the Red Bull, Alonso joining Vettel would be a MASSIVE battle. I can't imagine Alonso partnering another number 1 driver such as Vettel, but that would be something to behold. At least one of the egos would be shattered - question is, which one...? I know who I'd put my money on!
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You know you want to. [judgegrudge.mybrute.com]
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You know you want to. [judgegrudge.mybrute.com]
This story looks a little different when you take into account the warning he received from di Montezemolo this morning.
Looks like Fred is getting fed up with life at the Scuderia.
gav Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Nope, can't see him making that mistake again.
> He'd want guaranteed equal status, and while I'm
> sure Red Bull would promise it, I'm sure he'd know
> that there'd always be a favoured driver, even if
> not intentionally (I'm sure Red Bull don't
> intentionally sabotage Webber's car, but damn does
> he have some bad luck - are Red Bull incapable of
> supporting two cars reliably?).
Regarding the problem of running a two car team, it was certainly something that a number of drivers complained of both in the Stewart and Jaguar days.
Races: 163 - Wins: 23 - Pole Positions: 24 - Fastest Laps: 22
Season 9: Constructors' Champions
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/29/2013 09:14PM by Ferrari2007.
Looks like Fred is getting fed up with life at the Scuderia.
gav Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Nope, can't see him making that mistake again.
> He'd want guaranteed equal status, and while I'm
> sure Red Bull would promise it, I'm sure he'd know
> that there'd always be a favoured driver, even if
> not intentionally (I'm sure Red Bull don't
> intentionally sabotage Webber's car, but damn does
> he have some bad luck - are Red Bull incapable of
> supporting two cars reliably?).
Regarding the problem of running a two car team, it was certainly something that a number of drivers complained of both in the Stewart and Jaguar days.
Races: 163 - Wins: 23 - Pole Positions: 24 - Fastest Laps: 22
Season 9: Constructors' Champions
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/29/2013 09:14PM by Ferrari2007.
Incident 2k9 Wrote:
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> Alonso isn't a man who'd
> renege on a seemingly watertight contract with
> Ferrari.
Can't believe their contract is water proof against car being too slow to fight against Red Bull, Mercedes or even Lotus.
And lets not forget the wind tunnel issues. Ferrari is using Toyota's wind tunnel in Germany instead of their own to test next years car (that doesn't sound too handy).
Ferrari is at the moment simply just one huge mess.
gav Wrote:
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> Kimi on the other hand I'm sure wouldn't bat an
> eyelid. He just wouldn't give a damn.
Kimi already had a change even two times to drive in a same team with Alonso, but he run away both times.
Alonso had McLaren deal ready already back in 2005 so Kimi had time to decide what to do.
And for 2010 they both had contract with Ferrari (and Massa didn't). Kimi have told he could have continued at Ferrari if he just wanted to do so.
Honestly people are taking this Kimi's "I don't care"-crap bit too seriously. Seems more like Alonso doesn't give a damn even some anti-fanboys try to spread wrong kind image of him.
Kimi, so, Massa Fernando Sebastian is faster than you. Can you confirm you understood that message?
Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 07/29/2013 09:38PM by IWE.
-------------------------------------------------------
> Alonso isn't a man who'd
> renege on a seemingly watertight contract with
> Ferrari.
Can't believe their contract is water proof against car being too slow to fight against Red Bull, Mercedes or even Lotus.
And lets not forget the wind tunnel issues. Ferrari is using Toyota's wind tunnel in Germany instead of their own to test next years car (that doesn't sound too handy).
Ferrari is at the moment simply just one huge mess.
gav Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Kimi on the other hand I'm sure wouldn't bat an
> eyelid. He just wouldn't give a damn.
Kimi already had a change even two times to drive in a same team with Alonso, but he run away both times.
Alonso had McLaren deal ready already back in 2005 so Kimi had time to decide what to do.
And for 2010 they both had contract with Ferrari (and Massa didn't). Kimi have told he could have continued at Ferrari if he just wanted to do so.
Honestly people are taking this Kimi's "I don't care"-crap bit too seriously. Seems more like Alonso doesn't give a damn even some anti-fanboys try to spread wrong kind image of him.
Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 07/29/2013 09:38PM by IWE.
Mad notion indeed. Nonetheless, there are comparisons to be made...
1995/6: Alesi-Ferrari-Schumacher-Benetton
2013/4: Alonso-Ferrari-Vettel-Red Bull
The successful German seems to have everything going his own way at a team built around him. On the other hand, the passionate driver whose surname begins with the letter A clearly was able to show bags of talent in the earlier stages of his career, but try as he might, he can't turn around the fortunes of this mess of a once-great team. The German, however, is willing to put a (temorary) halt to his success in order to take up the challenge of bringing the prancing horse back to it's former glory...
GPGSL -
GPGSL-3 - Pizza Party Racing manager and driver
Nations Cup - Team Scotland manager
1995/6: Alesi-Ferrari-Schumacher-Benetton
2013/4: Alonso-Ferrari-Vettel-Red Bull
The successful German seems to have everything going his own way at a team built around him. On the other hand, the passionate driver whose surname begins with the letter A clearly was able to show bags of talent in the earlier stages of his career, but try as he might, he can't turn around the fortunes of this mess of a once-great team. The German, however, is willing to put a (temorary) halt to his success in order to take up the challenge of bringing the prancing horse back to it's former glory...
GPGSL -
GPGSL-3 - Pizza Party Racing manager and driver
Nations Cup - Team Scotland manager
Vettel has achieved already what every F1 driver wants to by the end of their career - and he is still only what, 25 years old?
He has EASILY another 10 years of career left in him. If he made the switch to Ferrari, we're talking the same length Schumacher had to turn Ferrari around. Except Ferrari are in a much better shape than they were back then. Vettel only needs that 'built the team from zero to hero' card to add to his career (bar matching the world champ records etc).
Alonso to Red Bull? Wow. On its own, meh. To partner Vettel? Crikey, that would be something not seen since Prost/Senna. Incredible prospect.
I do wonder if that happened, would Webber be lured out of retirement to partner Massa/Hulk at a reformed Ferrari? With the prospect of a Hulk/Bianchi tifosi in the coming years...
I can see Button calling it a day before his contract is up. It's nothing but transitional years now, especially with Honda another season and a half away. I see him fading into overlooked also rans like Heidfeld/Trulli.
Jenson drives it like he owns it; Lewis drives it like he stole it
He has EASILY another 10 years of career left in him. If he made the switch to Ferrari, we're talking the same length Schumacher had to turn Ferrari around. Except Ferrari are in a much better shape than they were back then. Vettel only needs that 'built the team from zero to hero' card to add to his career (bar matching the world champ records etc).
Alonso to Red Bull? Wow. On its own, meh. To partner Vettel? Crikey, that would be something not seen since Prost/Senna. Incredible prospect.
I do wonder if that happened, would Webber be lured out of retirement to partner Massa/Hulk at a reformed Ferrari? With the prospect of a Hulk/Bianchi tifosi in the coming years...
I can see Button calling it a day before his contract is up. It's nothing but transitional years now, especially with Honda another season and a half away. I see him fading into overlooked also rans like Heidfeld/Trulli.
Vettel's still too stuck on "tokens", as Brundle described them, to move to an inferior team—yet.
Given it's the summer break and the Alonso/Vettel story is unlikely to rumble on (with credible sources) for much longer, I'll derail the thread.
As much as I like the chap, I've never massively rated Button. In 2009 I felt Brawn was favouring him over Barrichello (and I've always had a large soft spot for Rubens, though never rated him too much either).
I felt it was a mistake him leaving for McLaren to partner Hamilton, though incredibly brave, but those years have shown that he's as good as they come if the situation suits him—the problem is most seasons are fairly stable and almost invariably favour the faster driver more.
Let's put it another way—sat alongside Hakkinen, Schumacher, Alonso, Raikkonen (minus the post-WDC Kimi), Hamilton, Vettel or perhaps even Montoya (all top drivers during Button's time in F1), how often would Button come out on top? Would his 2011 success over Hamilton be the only time? I'd bet there wouldn't be many more seasons. Still, if you look at it like that, he's been stupendously successful for a second tier driver.
Trulli and Heidfeld, he's probably not as quick as Jarno (before he faded - he was quicker than Alonso at times) and a touch quicker than Heidfeld, but he's got the much stronger head than both combined.
Given it's the summer break and the Alonso/Vettel story is unlikely to rumble on (with credible sources) for much longer, I'll derail the thread.
As much as I like the chap, I've never massively rated Button. In 2009 I felt Brawn was favouring him over Barrichello (and I've always had a large soft spot for Rubens, though never rated him too much either).I felt it was a mistake him leaving for McLaren to partner Hamilton, though incredibly brave, but those years have shown that he's as good as they come if the situation suits him—the problem is most seasons are fairly stable and almost invariably favour the faster driver more.
Let's put it another way—sat alongside Hakkinen, Schumacher, Alonso, Raikkonen (minus the post-WDC Kimi), Hamilton, Vettel or perhaps even Montoya (all top drivers during Button's time in F1), how often would Button come out on top? Would his 2011 success over Hamilton be the only time? I'd bet there wouldn't be many more seasons. Still, if you look at it like that, he's been stupendously successful for a second tier driver.
Trulli and Heidfeld, he's probably not as quick as Jarno (before he faded - he was quicker than Alonso at times) and a touch quicker than Heidfeld, but he's got the much stronger head than both combined.
Canada 2011 - Button at his best.
GPGSL -
GPGSL-3 - Pizza Party Racing manager and driver
Nations Cup - Team Scotland manager
GPGSL -
GPGSL-3 - Pizza Party Racing manager and driver
Nations Cup - Team Scotland manager
I don't see a Alonso - Vettel pairing happening in any team as they're both too selfish to work as equals, any team would need a car of McLaren MP4/4 levels of dominance otherwise they'd simply take too many points off each other and other teams would sneak the championships.
Montzelemo's pop at Alonso kind of reminds me of back in 1991 when Prost made a disparaging remark about the car and promptly found himself sacked. But I doubt they'd be brave enough to sack Alonso as times are adifferent from back then.
With regards to Button, he'll never be regarded as a great and he'll forever be rated below his peers such as Alonso, Kimi, Hamilton, Vettel and possibly Montoya. But let's examine the facts. He was rated so well in his junior career that he jumped straight from F3 to F1 (with about 2 years experience outside of karting) he became (the then) youngest ever driver to score an F1 point, to date he has won 15 Grand Prix and a world championship, he is one of the most experienced F1 drivers of all time and he's still capable of beating the best and winning on his day. In 20 years from now when looking through the history stats we'll say.. He was no Fangio but you know what? He did well.
Montzelemo's pop at Alonso kind of reminds me of back in 1991 when Prost made a disparaging remark about the car and promptly found himself sacked. But I doubt they'd be brave enough to sack Alonso as times are adifferent from back then.
With regards to Button, he'll never be regarded as a great and he'll forever be rated below his peers such as Alonso, Kimi, Hamilton, Vettel and possibly Montoya. But let's examine the facts. He was rated so well in his junior career that he jumped straight from F3 to F1 (with about 2 years experience outside of karting) he became (the then) youngest ever driver to score an F1 point, to date he has won 15 Grand Prix and a world championship, he is one of the most experienced F1 drivers of all time and he's still capable of beating the best and winning on his day. In 20 years from now when looking through the history stats we'll say.. He was no Fangio but you know what? He did well.
It's a juicy one.
I'm hoping either Kimi or Fernando joins Vettel next year, purely to see how he handles having a Champion teammate. Ricciardo, as good as he is, would be the safe option.
It was interesting to see Seb's reaction at the weekend when Lee asked him about his preference of teammate. Clearly he'd rather have the ultimate driving genius(Kimi) alongside him than the ultimate political heavyweight. I think he already knows what a disturbing influence within the team Fernando would probably be.
My passionate side wants Kimi to go there, but my mischievous side wants Fernando to go there - that would be awesome. Fireworks.
I'm hoping either Kimi or Fernando joins Vettel next year, purely to see how he handles having a Champion teammate. Ricciardo, as good as he is, would be the safe option.
It was interesting to see Seb's reaction at the weekend when Lee asked him about his preference of teammate. Clearly he'd rather have the ultimate driving genius(Kimi) alongside him than the ultimate political heavyweight. I think he already knows what a disturbing influence within the team Fernando would probably be.
My passionate side wants Kimi to go there, but my mischievous side wants Fernando to go there - that would be awesome. Fireworks.
I wonder, IF Vet + Alo were to swap, what the drivermarket would look like? I don't think that Nando + Kimi would want to team with each other, certainly not Kimi...
Or, what if Alonso went to Lotus?
GPGSL -
GPGSL-3 - Pizza Party Racing manager and driver
Nations Cup - Team Scotland manager
Or, what if Alonso went to Lotus?
GPGSL -
GPGSL-3 - Pizza Party Racing manager and driver
Nations Cup - Team Scotland manager
There's similarities with the situation at Williams in 1992, when their #1 driver and Champion Mansell(Vettel) had Prost(Alonso) and Senna(Kimi) fighting for the seat alongside him, and in the end Hill(Ricciardo) ended up in that seat.
(Not making exact comparisons by the way, just saying which driver is the current equivalent of which.)
(Not making exact comparisons by the way, just saying which driver is the current equivalent of which.)
That was shaping up to be a good put-down till you admitted to reading Autosport.
Well, good luck in reading behind the headlines once you've read 30 in a month - it's ****! :P
GPGSL -
GPGSL-3 - Pizza Party Racing manager and driver
Nations Cup - Team Scotland manager
GPGSL -
GPGSL-3 - Pizza Party Racing manager and driver
Nations Cup - Team Scotland manager
The more I think about it, the more I want Fernando to go there. RedBull will be drawn to him to an extent as he's the most complete driver out there - and possibly a free one soon too if he falls out with Ferrari, as he's showing signs of doing. They'd have the two most successful current drivers driving for them, so they can't not be tempted.
A major factor will be whether they're prepared to bow to Seb's wishes or not.
A major factor will be whether they're prepared to bow to Seb's wishes or not.
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