2012 Brazilian Grand Prix***Spoilers***

marcl Wrote:
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> The green flag that was shown does not mean the
> yellows are not valid, that green flag is to tell
> the drivers leaving the pit lane that they are
> free to re join. When Vettel makes the pass the
> yellows are out.
>
> It was the same in the USA a few years back, MS
> passed a car under green but turn 1 was under
> yellow but as the move was complete it was ok.
>
> Vettel did not pass under green he passed under
> yellow and its clear to see.
>
> It will be interesting to see what happens.
>
> All this talk about if vettel got the penalty in
> the race he would have not lost much time due to
> the saftey car should not be taken into account.
> Had Lewis taken his drive through at Spa in 2008
> he would have lost more than 20 seconds as the pit
> lane is shorter. Had vettel taken a drive through
> in Brazil he would have lost 25 seconds as the pit
> lane is longer than 20 seconds.
>
> I dont think anything will happen as all the books
> have been printed showing Vettel to be world
> champion and the videos will be heading to the
> shops soon. This was the reason they gave in 1997
> for allowing MS to keep his wins despite being
> excluded from the championship.

Wrong, all that matters is the waved green flag from the marshal's post. It can be clearly seen on the .gif posted on several places, the green flag automaticaly overwrites the flashing yellows seen before...Vettel's overtake was completely legal.

The yellows are controlled by race control though and that is what they should be using, the lights were put there as drivers complained they could not see the flags.

It depends what everyone is reading.

marcl Wrote:
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> The yellows are controlled by race control though
> and that is what they should be using, the lights
> were put there as drivers complained they could
> not see the flags.

They are indeed controlled by race control, but the regulations are very clear in that their function is to provide additional information to the drivers. Official signalling is still provided by flags, and it is the flags that take precedence. This is precisely what is outlined in Liuzzi's appeal rejection.

> It depends what everyone is reading.

The FIA Technical regs, and the aforementioned appeal. So far, I've not seen any team, driver, official or even creditable journalist suggest that anything else has occurred. All of this seems to have stemmed from that Italian newspaper article.

I would have honestly preferred Alonso to have won the title, but Vettel really has not done anything wrong.

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Well the FIA have said there is no case and the lights on the wheel mean @#$%& all its just the flags that count.

vesuvius was correct.

In related news: Ferrari to challenge Christmas

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As it looks Vettel has done nothing wrong. Moaning and bitching and not accepting defeat does account for sportsmanship. Ferrari should be the last to complain about "unfair" behavior. And they should tell Alonso not to twitter anymore. Stuff like this has nothing to do with sport. .

From a neutral point of view both Alonso/Ferrari and Vettel/Red Bull gave their best. Bothe would have deserved the title. In the end Vettel won - and the Red Bulkl wasn't that dominant as some people claim. It wasn't really reliable and in terms of speed McLarens were faster (as could be seen on long straights). The championship is over, now move on.

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REHAB IS FOR QUITTERS

apparently that tweet is from Massa?
why would Ferrari tell Alonso not to tweet anymore anyways?, i really enjoy his tweets and how open he is posting pictures and behind the scenes info we would never get from anyone, even journalists.

about the Vettel incident, i think people and media have created a bigger deal than what really happened, Ferrari haven't filled an official protest, they just wrote a letter seeking clarification.
i can only speak for myself, but i would think the 600+ people working in that team day in day out, just to keep fighting for the championship, the ammount of money at stake, the glory and all, it would be silly not to seek clarification, there were some questions about wheter Vettel did something wrong or not, and to just sit tight and let it go would be a bit unfair for the people working behind the scenes hard to win, and a bit selfish from us judging them just for doing it.

unless there are some people here working for one of the teams involved, i'd say none of us have any idea of what happens behind the scenes and how those people work to bring home the glory. Sending a little letter to the FIA seeking clarification and receiving it was diplomatic imho, and i'm now 100% sure Vettel's move was LEGAL, but i wasn't yesterday, i'm sure there are millions of people who think the same.

Here's a pencil:



Now let's draw a line under it all.

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GPGSL: S6 - TafuroGP Tester (14th) /// S7 - ART Tester (6th) /// S8 - Demon Driver (13th) /// S9 - Demon/Snake Driver (13th) /// S10 - Snake Driver (???) ///]
"My ambition is handicapped by laziness" - Charles Bukowski

If Vettel's move had been illegal or dodgy in any way, it would've been brought up during or immediately after the race, not 3 days later.
Storms in teacups like this never come to anything. I remember after the 2007 Brazilian GP, when there was a situation involving the BMWs and Rosberg's Williams allegedly having their fuel stored at the wrong temperature - surprise surprise, nothing happened.
I'm glad the result will be standing - like pretty much everyone else here, I wouldn't have wanted Alonso to win the title like that.

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not read this thread since sunday i think, but i can imagine the arguments that have gone on. if there was something potentially illegal, it needed to be investigated. it was investigated and found to be legal, so that's fine, let's move on. congrats to red bull and seb.

i like sniffpetrol's follow up: click

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RIP Jules, never to be forgotten. #KeepFightingMichael